Russian Ukraine Invasion

Kornee Offline
(Mar 2, 2022 08:05 PM)stryder Wrote: One wayward thing to consider.  What if Putin has already got plans for a world reset, where he has for years been building a bunker, tricking it out with supplies and deciding who's on his guest list.  With the actually intension to literally burn the world.  We assume that M.A.D (Mutually Assured Destruction) was a way to stop nuclear powers throwing them round everytime they have a tandrum, but what if the madman actually plans to wipe the (world) slate clean and start afresh.  (Less people, less problems. more meglomanic control etc.)
Wayward is the operative word. But yes The Imaginarium of Doctor Parnassus was a truly enjoyable fantasy flick. Can't recall it including a crazed Putin reigning down planet-wide fire and brimstone though. Huh
But guess what - there really is such a burn-the-world-down scenario. And it's been in place for decades. With nary a murmur of disapproval. Yes it's true! Not part of some fantasy/shock-horror Hollywood flick.
Hint - look up Samson Option!
Reply
Kornee Offline
OK it's such a chore to do a simple (non-Google!) web search. So here, delivered on a silver platter:
https://archive.org/details/Sampson_Option
I agree with the forward/Summary there, and the to date sole review of may 25, 2021
Bracing for the expected reflex reaction to kick in - HARD!
Reply
Yazata Offline
Day 7 Situation Report. To date, the Russians have committed some 80% of the forces they had built up around Ukraine's borders.

https://militaryland.net/ukraine/invasio...7-summary/

Things are largely unchanged on the map. Russians seem to be trying to encircle Kyiv, but it's going very slowly. The '40 mile convoy' from the north has been stopped for two days now. It isn't known why. It's a sitting duck for air attack, but Ukraine doesn't have enough airpower left to tear it up. The Russians are facing fierce Ukrainian resistance in the direction of the city, so they are moving south further out from the city and have cut a major highway leading west. The Ukrainians have counterattacked them there but haven't been able to reopen the highway. There are several mechanized columns heading toward Kyiv from the Russian border to the east, but they are suffering losses from ambushes by troops with antitank weapons. To the south of Kyiv it's still pretty open.

To the east, the Russians seem to have given up sending troops into Kharkiv for the time being and are pounding it with artillery, rockets, cruise missles, even hyperbaric bombs. It looks like a major change of tactics away from the original plan of rushing small forces in, seizing government offices and declaring themselves in control. The new plan seems to be to keep Russian forces out of urban street fighting to reduce casaulties, instead surrounding the city while pounding it mercilessly to reduce its ability to resist when troops eventually go in. Meanwhile we see motorized columns ranging out through the rural farming areas.

In the south, troops from Crimea have taken Kherson but the Ukrainians have reinforced nearby Mykolaiv. After failing several times to take Mykolaiv, the Russians seem to have given up for the time being and have sent a column out into the farmland. It isn't clear what its objective is. The large port city of Odessa to the west has Russian warships standing offshore but hasn't been attacked yet apart from airstrikes. Meanwhile troops are trying to take all the small towns between Crimea and the Dnepr river which is widened into reservoir lakes that are serving as kind of a defensive moat. And a big column has moved east along the coast of the Sea of Azov through several towns until it met up with forces from the Separatist areas. These combined forces have surrounded and are pounding the small port city of Mariupol with artillery. By all accounts several residential neighborhoods in Mariupol have been obliterated and loss of life is high. But latest is that the Russians haven't entered the city yet.
Reply
stryder Offline
(Mar 3, 2022 06:41 AM)Yazata Wrote: Day 7 Situation Report. To date, the Russians have committed some 80% of the forces they had built up around Ukraine's borders.

https://militaryland.net/ukraine/invasio...7-summary/

Things are largely unchanged on the map. Russians seem to be trying to encircle Kyiv, but it's going very slowly. The '40 mile convoy' from the north has been stopped for two days now. It isn't known why. It's a sitting duck for air attack, but Ukraine doesn't have enough airpower left to tear it up.

The convoy might not have a huge manpower, it might actually contain supplies for fortification, or for the capture of civilians and combatants alike. (They would need vehicles to ferry people to blacksites) Consider that sitting a vehicle cab for days would be a tiresome toll on it's own, if those vehicles were full of men there would likely be more pedestrian visual activity (tents etc).

There is also the possibility that the Convoy is actually filled with Nazi memorabilia. Part of Putins claimed reasons for being (Claiming that Ukraine is filled with Nazi's) requires evidence to be found, they are going to need a city that is intact enough to mysteriously find their hidden stash of Nazi loot. (Likely loot kept after the second world war by Russia)
Reply
confused2 Offline
Yazata Wrote:The '40 mile convoy' from the north has been stopped for two days now. It isn't known why. It's a sitting duck for air attack, but Ukraine doesn't have enough airpower left to tear it up.
NATO could tear it up (and start WW3) - I'm guessing that's why it's there. I'm hoping the US is dusting off their ICBMs, seeing if the boot disks still work - yay - floppy drives.
Reply
Yazata Offline
Dramatic events at the Antonov airport in Hostomel. After the Russians took control of it they have been using it to fly in troops and supplies. Today it looks like the Ukrainians attacked it and may have retaken the Russians main supply base near Kiev. It isn't clear how long they can continue to hold it, but Russian supply flights have evidently been disrupted for the time being. Perhaps this might explain why the '40 mile convoy' stopped, because it was headed here. This won't help the Russians' evident logistics problems getting fuel, food and ammunition to their forces.

https://twitter.com/Militarylandnet/stat...7858708484

The Russians have entered a small city called Enerhodar along the Dnepr river north of Crimea. Fighting ongoing.

Shelling of surrounded Mariupol continues, but Russian ground forces still haven't entered the city. Civilian casaulties are probably very heavy there, since much of the city is flattened.

And many Russian ships have gathered in the Black Sea off Odessa. The Ukrainians anticipate a D-day style amphibious landing and are preparing shore defenses.

https://twitter.com/Militarylandnet/stat...3068065795
Reply
Zinjanthropos Offline
Quote:There is also the possibility that the Convoy is actually filled with Nazi memorabilia. Part of Putins claimed reasons for being (Claiming that Ukraine is filled with Nazi's) requires evidence to be found, they are going to need a city that is intact enough to mysteriously find their hidden stash of Nazi loot. (Likely loot kept after the second world war by Russia)


If true that would tell me that the Russians have no intent on waging a world war with nukes. Merely show and tell or an I told you so moment. In some strange macabre way that gives world a reason to be optimistic. I think it is known that many Ukrainians welcomed the Nazis during Barbarossa. Russians haven’t forgot.
Reply
Secular Sanity Offline
Maybe I’m wrong in thinking…WTF is wrong with us? Why on earth would someone, who has the opportunity to interview President Vladimir Putin go on and on about his soul? Biden said, "Mr. President, I’m looking in your eyes and you have no soul." Biden did say that he said this to Putin, but I highly doubt that he did, and even if he did, who gives two fucks? It’s a dumb thing for a President to say to another world leader.


https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/m6pJd6O_NT0

The interviewer asked Putin about cyberwar and hacking, but we have cybercrime, as well. What about the whole Cambridge Analytica data scandal? He goes on to say that Putin clearly wants to negotiate, but you must have something to negotiate with. You don’t ask for a truce unless you’re fighting in a war. Well, first of all, negotiations and compromising should be ongoing. It’s all part of doing business. But Putin was even able to handle that awkward line of questioning by saying as far as war is concerned, NATO, officially, I would like to draw your attention to that. NATO has officially stated that it considers cyberspace as a battlefield—an area of military action and conducts military exercises. He interrupts and accuses Russia of being involved in that battlefield—fighting on that battlefield. Putin denies this and says that they don’t want that. NATO is doing military exercises in this area, and we should be able to do the same, but we don’t want that. Just like we don’t want space militarized, we don’t want cyberspace militarized, and we have suggested on many occasions to work together on cybersecurity, but your government refuses to. The USSR and the U.S. did agree to contain the nuclear arms race. Cyberspace is a very sensitive area. As of today, a great deal of human endeavors relies upon digital technologies, including the functioning of government, and everybody understands that any interference can cause a great deal of damage, and I’m repeating this for the third time, let’s sit down together, and agree on joint work, and how to achieve security in this area. Putin goes on to ask why wouldn’t our government want to work together in this area when accusations keep coming up about attacks? Both our countries are worried about the same thing.

The interviewer goes on to accuse Putin of whataboutism, and Putin did accuse America of hypocrisy, but at the same time, he explained the reasons behind what happened. He goes on to accuse Putin of being a killer, but we have the same conspiracy theories here in the U.S. e.g., the Clinton Body Count.

They start discussing Ukraine and Georgia. Putin says to just imagine if they sent troops into direct proximity to our borders. He said that we conduct military war games in Alaska, but he doesn’t respond because it’s in our territory, but when he did it on his borders, we crossed an ocean and brought thousands of personnel and thousands of units of military equipment close to our borders, and yet you believe that we acted aggressively, and somehow, you’re not. That’s a pot calling the kettle black.

He mentioned his constant complaints about NATO’s militarization to his west but asked him why he never complains about China’s militarization to his east. "The first thing that I want to say is that over the last few years—the last few decades, we have developed a strategic partnership relationship between Russia and China that had previously not been achieved in the history of our two nations. A high level of trust and cooperation and in all areas of politics, the economy, technology, and in the area of military technical cooperation. We do not believe that China is a threat to us. That’s one—China is a friendly nation. It has not declared us an enemy as the United States has done. Don’t you know anything about this? That’s number one. Number two is that China is a huge powerful country, one and half billion people in terms of purchasing power parity, the Chinese economy has exceeded the size of the U.S. economy and in terms of trade for the previous year, China tied with Europe with first place whereas the U.S. dropped to the second position. Do you know about this? China has been developing and I understand that what’s beginning to happen is a certain, well, a certain kind of confrontation with China. Everybody understands it. We can see it. Why hide from this fact? The most important thing is our nature and level of our relationship with China. You said that China has four aircraft carriers. How many does the U.S. have?" The interviewer answered, "a lot more." Putin says, "Well, there you go, that’s my point."

He goes on to make so many other good points. His responses to the crisis have been defensive, not offensive. If he was out to create a greater Russia, he would have taken Crimea sooner. Putin didn’t paint himself into a corner. We’ve forced his hand. Why? Was it to weaken Russia or are we just that delusional about the promotion of democracy and/or globalism?

They already decided in 2008 that Ukraine and Georgia could join NATO, but now…crickets. They put in an application to join the EU and are begging for immediate acceptance, but thus far, the words of encouragement are just symbolic.

What am I missing here because it looks to me like we’re the bad guys, and Ukraine…a sacrificial lamb? < (non-rhetorical)
Reply
Reply
confused2 Offline
Putin wants to look good.
Putin gives an interview.
Putin looks good.
I feel like I'm missing something too (1 being SS post above).
Edit - nice move accidentally putting Putin in with tallest interviewer on the planet.
Reply




Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)