I stand corrected re MOAB = thermobaric bomb. Anyway....
So the party Line (US/NATO = Good, Russia/Belarus = Bad) focuses attention on the utter immorality of evil Putin potentially authorizing the use of flame thrower style ordinance in Ukraine conflict.
It might be a good idea to check out the historical origins and usage of flame throwers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flamethrower#History
I was surprised to find out China actually invented that instrument of warfare. Regardless of origins, it's widespread use by all major combatants in WW2 hardly allows anyone to claim moral high ground re it's use.
As the saying goes "All's fair in love and war". Name one humanitarian killing and/or debilitating instrument of warfare. Arguably the worst 'instrument of warfare' is 'black propaganda'. Who's results can be extended indefinitely to pillory
and burden with perpetual guilt generation after generation, an entire nation/ethnic group.
There hasn't been a whole lot of change on the map since yesterday.
Consensus seems to be that the Russians didn't expect the kind of fierce resistance they encountered. So today seems to have largely been devoted to sending in reinforcements and addressing weaknesses in logistics that left many Russian military vehicles out of fuel. There are satellite photos of military convoys miles long heading into Ukraine.
(Feb 27, 2022 08:29 PM)C C Wrote: If nothing else, Russian jets (or guided missiles) could start bombing the cities to rubble like they did in the Syrian intervention a few years back (Aleppo, etc).
They seem to be doing that at Kharkiv, Ukraine's second largest city. The Russians penetrated deeply into the city center, but suffered heavy casualties and losses of vehicles and were forced to retreat back to the city's industrial fringes.
Rather than trying that again, the Russians are making heavy use of GRAD multiple rocket launchers. These fire many unguided rockets in quick succession and are most effective at striking an entire area rather than a precise target.
There have also been photographs of the Russians moving up heavy long-range artillery outside Kharkiv. And there are reports of SU-34 jets dropping unguided "dumb" bombs on Kharkiv.
So there seems to have been a change of plans and the Russians have switched to a strategy of standing back and pounding the place.
Photo taken outside of Kharkiv of a GRAD launcher on a tracked vehicle.
For those with long memories and a sense of equity, that so reminds of US 'shock and awe' tactics to soften up Baghdad prior to full scale boots-on-the-ground 'liberation' (ha ha) of Iraq. Madison Avenue spin wins again.
C CMar 1, 2022 08:25 AM (This post was last modified: Mar 1, 2022 08:49 AM by C C.)
(Mar 1, 2022 07:30 AM)Kornee Wrote:
(Feb 28, 2022 10:06 PM)Yazata Wrote: [...] So there seems to have been a change of plans and the Russians have switched to a strategy of standing back and pounding the place...
For those with long memories and a sense of equity, that so reminds of US 'shock and awe' tactics to soften up Baghdad prior to full scale boots-on-the-ground 'liberation' (ha ha) of Iraq. Madison Avenue spin wins again.
Plus, Iraq's less than two decade stint as a mere annexed territory of the US could even be on the road to being over in a few months, when citizens there vote on a statehood referendum.
We gotta' stop and wave at their soccer team fans, too, while the camera is pointing. Yay, go Lions of Mesopotamia!
(Feb 28, 2022 10:06 PM)Yazata Wrote: [...] So there seems to have been a change of plans and the Russians have switched to a strategy of standing back and pounding the place...
For those with long memories and a sense of equity, that so reminds of US 'shock and awe' tactics to soften up Baghdad prior to full scale boots-on-the-ground 'liberation' (ha ha) of Iraq. Madison Avenue spin wins again.
Plus, Iraq's less than two decade stint as a mere annexed territory of the US could even be on the road to being over in a few months, when citizens there vote on a statehood referendum.
We gotta' stop and wave at their soccer team fans, too, while the camera is pointing. Yay, go Lions of Mesopotamia!
OK, my tentative response is that sounds like straight out fair comment. That is, no subtle irony is implied.
(Mar 1, 2022 03:43 AM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: Anybody know what the weapon is that ignites fuel vapour thats laid down prior to setting it off? I think it's a weapon that violates the Geneva Convention therefore it would be a war crime every time it's used. Thinking the Russians are about to step it up since whatever they're doing now is either not working or too slow.
Well ok it's a chore to do a web search
I’ll try to remember that. Hope I can do better next time.
(Mar 1, 2022 03:43 AM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: Anybody know what the weapon is that ignites fuel vapour thats laid down prior to setting it off? I think it's a weapon that violates the Geneva Convention therefore it would be a war crime every time it's used. Thinking the Russians are about to step it up since whatever they're doing now is either not working or too slow.
Well ok it's a chore to do a web search
I’ll try to remember that. Hope I can do better next time.
Oh and thanks Yaz.
Well thanks. But I do occasionally stumble. See progressively #79-#81.
(Mar 1, 2022 03:43 AM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: Anybody know what the weapon is that ignites fuel vapour thats laid down prior to setting it off? I think it's a weapon that violates the Geneva Convention therefore it would be a war crime every time it's used. Thinking the Russians are about to step it up since whatever they're doing now is either not working or too slow.
This?
The TOS-1 was first used during the Soviet war in Afghanistan, The Guardian said, and was also deployed in Chechnya and the Syrian civil war.
It can launch two types of warheads — incendiary and fuel-air explosives. The latter, also called vacuum or thermobaric rockets, work by using oxygen from the surrounding air to generate a high-temperature explosion.
(Mar 1, 2022 03:43 AM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: Anybody know what the weapon is that ignites fuel vapour thats laid down prior to setting it off? I think it's a weapon that violates the Geneva Convention therefore it would be a war crime every time it's used. Thinking the Russians are about to step it up since whatever they're doing now is either not working or too slow.
This?
The TOS-1 was first used during the Soviet war in Afghanistan, The Guardian said, and was also deployed in Chechnya and the Syrian civil war.
It can launch two types of warheads — incendiary and fuel-air explosives. The latter, also called vacuum or thermobaric rockets, work by using oxygen from the surrounding air to generate a high-temperature explosion.
Yes C2, it was the latter I was thinking about. Thanks. Got a bad feeling Russia is going to use a few shortly.
YazataMar 1, 2022 05:23 PM (This post was last modified: Mar 1, 2022 05:32 PM by Yazata.)
In news today, the biggest day 6 events so far seem to be...
First, that the Russians have taken Kherson (along the Black Sea, between Crimea and Odessa) after a siege. but have again been repelled at nearby Mykolaiv.
And several large explosions detonated near the TV tower in Kyiv. If the Russians were trying to take down the tower, they failed and its still standing. But it's possible that they were hitting something else near the tower. The TV studios?
Mar 1, 2022 05:37 AM
![[Image: 2022_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine.svg]](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4f/2022_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine.svg)
![[Image: FMm0OH5XIAER8zA?format=jpg&name=small]](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FMm0OH5XIAER8zA?format=jpg&name=small)
Hope I can do better next time. 
