UK fury over body cam footage of dying Henry Nowak being arrested (watchdog fashions)

[confused2]

Living in an 'inner city' environment for 30 years maybe gives one a different (better?) perspective.
Folks aren't taking into account how much the police know about an incident before they are expected to deal with it.. they know nothing. The killer (actually his brother) has called for police assistance .. kind'a gives the strong impression that the other guy (Nowak) is the one who should be arrested .. with our MENSA level IQ we can immediately see this is wrong .. but the police on the ground didn't see it .. because there's no possible way they could have worked that out with the evidence available to them.
Why put handcuffs on him? This is really difficult
a)He's been described a violent and policepeople aren't keen on being punched in the face .. for some reason that seems to escape a lot of people.
b)Jumping up and running away is a standard escape strategy .. handcuffs make escape less likely and easier to deal with if/when it happens (slows runner down)
Years ago I 'apprehended' a criminal and restrained him in a choke hold while waiting for the police to arrive. At the time he said "Please let me go, I'll lose my job'.. probably true .. now he would say "I can't breathe'.. probably not true .. I didn't have to make the judgement call because the pos I was restraining didn't know to say it, now they all do.
The police didn't see any evidence of stabbing .. no blood. At this point Nowak should have called for a pathologists report to raise the possibility that the type of knife he had been stabbed with was designed to create deep seated bleeding rather than the more impressive slasher blades the police were probably more familiar with. We can add "I've been stabbed" to the list of reasons why people should be given a chance to jump up and run away.
Like Elon said when Bezos rocket blew up "Rockets are hard" .. policing is hard too.

[Zinjanthropos]

Did we have:

Diversity: yes, one white and one non-white involved

Equity: I guess so, killer had a unique need requiring the use of a different resource to level the playing field

Inclusion: sure, the killer was made to feel valued, respected and supported.

[C C]

Some people claim that neighbors called the police before Digwa's brother did, to report that a man had been stabbed. And that the police did not respond quickly to the first call, but did move rapidly when Gurpreet (the second call) told them that Nowak had engaged in a racial attack against Digwa. But while neighbors did hear Nowak say that he was stabbed, I can't find anything confirming that they notified the police.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_...wak#Murder

EXCERPT: There were no eyewitnesses to the attack, but neighbours heard Nowak say he had been stabbed and was dying.

Digwa's brother, Gurpreet Digwa, made the 999 call; he lied to the police, including repeatedly telling them that Digwa had been the victim of a racial attack and that no weapons were involved. Gurpreet said that Nowak needed medical attention, and the 999 operator said that police and an ambulance would be dispatched.

Nowak attempted to get away by climbing onto a wheelie bin and then over a fence. He had already suffered a fatal injury; a blood trail indicated he had already been stabbed. Digwa called his parents, who arrived before police.

Kiran Kaur, his mother, took Digwa's knife and hid it at their home. Digwa filmed Nowak fleeing and recorded another video as he lay dying; these were cited as aggravating factors at Digwa's sentencing.

[Zinjanthropos]

Kiran Kaur, his mother, took Digwa's knife and hid it at their home. Digwa filmed Nowak fleeing and recorded another video as he lay dying; these were cited as aggravating factors at Digwa's sentencing.

Digwa sounds as if he’s dumber than a bag of hammers. Probably gets it from mom.

How in hell do they pick a jury over there. One that hasn’t any bias yet is a mixed bag of races and such.

[geordief]

Kiran Kaur, his mother, took Digwa's knife and hid it at their home. Digwa filmed Nowak fleeing and recorded another video as he lay dying; these were cited as aggravating factors at Digwa's sentencing.

Digwa sounds as if he’s dumber than a bag of hammers. Probably gets it from mom.

How in hell do they pick a jury over there. One that hasn’t any bias yet is a mixed bag of races and such.

"Dumb as a bag of hammers" would likely be a redeeming feature.He is a murderer after all.

The trial is over ,so presumably the jury was not hard to select.

[stryder]

Kiran Kaur, his mother, took Digwa's knife and hid it at their home. Digwa filmed Nowak fleeing and recorded another video as he lay dying; these were cited as aggravating factors at Digwa's sentencing.

Digwa sounds as if he’s dumber than a bag of hammers. Probably gets it from mom.

How in hell do they pick a jury over there. One that hasn’t any bias yet is a mixed bag of races and such.

"Dumb as a bag of hammers" would likely be a redeeming feature.He is a murderer after all.

The trial is over ,so presumably the jury was not hard to select.

While he is at his majesty's leisure, the problem that now exists is if populists fanned by external goating decides to keep chasing wrong doing with the police. For instance if Nowak had died after falling off a wall while under arrest (as opposed to being stabbed) it would of resulted in the police dealing with a manslaughter charge.

You can not kill a person twice. So if the police are chased for such a charge they could inadvertently give a defence appeal a case to get a reduced sentence for the actual murderer.

[geordief]

Kiran Kaur, his mother, took Digwa's knife and hid it at their home. Digwa filmed Nowak fleeing and recorded another video as he lay dying; these were cited as aggravating factors at Digwa's sentencing.

Digwa sounds as if he’s dumber than a bag of hammers. Probably gets it from mom.

How in hell do they pick a jury over there. One that hasn’t any bias yet is a mixed bag of races and such.

"Dumb as a bag of hammers" would likely be a redeeming feature.He is a murderer after all.

The trial is over ,so presumably the jury was not hard to select.

While he is at his majesty's leisure, the problem that now exists is if populists fanned by external goating decides to keep chasing wrong doing with the police.  For instance if Nowak had died after falling off a wall while under arrest (as opposed to being stabbed) it would of resulted in the police dealing with a manslaughter charge.

You can not kill a person twice.  So if the police are chased for such a charge they could inadvertently give a defence appeal a case to get a reduced sentence for the actual murderer.

So you are saying that  an appeal of his sentence
might rely in part on the police being held partly accountable for the death and that he may not have died if the police response had been more effective?

I wonder if the Judge could have had this in the back of his head when he said that no intervention could have prevented his death.

Was there medical evidence produced in Court to show this?I have seen anonymous posters elsewhere claiming that his death could have been prevented.

[Syne]

Unless UK law is completely backwards and stupid, the police being held negligent for someone in their custody would have no bearing on the actual murder's case. Negligence of one party does not reduce the guilt of another.

[Yazata]

Digwa inflicted five "stab wounds or cuts" on Nowak, with the 21-centimetre (8.3 in) Sikh ceremonial knife he was carrying, including a fatal wound to the chest and additional wounds to his legs.

That's an aspect of this that I haven't seen discussed.

In the UK carrying a knife in public is illegal. But Sikhs are nevertheless allowed to carry "ceremonial" daggers, which as we saw in the Nowak case can be quite lethal. Anyone else carrying such a weapon would be subject to arrest and up to four years imprisonment. That looks to me like another example of two-tiered justice.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirpan

This is the legally allowed "ceremonial" knife that Vikrum Digwa used to kill Henry Nowak

[Image: HJyexzzXMAAmQJ0?format=jpg&name=small]

[Syne]

United Kingdom
As a bladed article, possession of a bladed article in a public place is illegal under section 139 of the Criminal Justice Act 1988, but there is a specific defence for a person charged to prove that he carries it for "religious reasons". There is an identical defence to the similar offence (section 139A) which relates to carrying bladed articles on school grounds. The official list of prohibited items at the London 2012 Summer Olympics venues prohibited all kinds of weapons, but explicitly allowed the kirpan.
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirpan#United_Kingdom

Sure sounds like special exceptions being made. And for the one religion that requires carrying a weapon:

The primary religion that requires initiated members to carry a ceremonial dagger is Sikhism.
Initiated Sikhs (known as Khalsa or Amritdhari Sikhs) are commanded to carry a kirpan at all times as one of the Five Articles of Faith (the "Five Ks").
- gemini

So special exceptions are made for the most violent religion to carry weapons otherwise banned. Seems this "religious commandment" tells us a lot about the nature of the religion.