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Keeping male bodies out of women’s rugby

#1
C C Offline
https://quillette.com/2020/09/27/keeping...ens-rugby/

EXCERPTS: . . . World Rugby, rugby’s global governing body, incorporated guidelines established by the International Olympic Committee (IOC) on transgender participation in sports. According to these rules, males who wish to self-identify into women’s rugby could do so if they committed to reducing their testosterone levels to 10 nmol per liter or lower for at least 12 months. (The average level for men is about seven times that level.)

During this period, instances of biological males playing in the women’s game increased, and some participants began to express alarm. One rugby referee posted on the website Fair Play for Women, for instance, that “being forced to prioritize hurt feelings over broken bones exposes me to personal litigation from female players who have been harmed by players who are biologically male. This is driving female players and referees out of the game.”

[...] In some cases, female rugby players and their coaches would show up to matches to discover that there was a biologically male athlete playing on the opposing team. As one player put it, “I have to play or forfeit my place even when I know its unsafe for me.” Those who enjoyed the advantage of having a trans-identifying player on their team, on the other hand, were sometimes found to be lacking in sympathy. On one occasion, a team captain was quoted as saying that their male-bodied player had “folded an opponent like a deck chair.”

With worries mounting about safety-especially concussions-and financial liability, World Rugby undertook a review of its transgender policy in February 2020. [...] World Rugby turned out be the first sport to bring to the table experts on all sides of the eligibility issue, including sociologists, biologists, kinesiologists (my own specialty), and those with a background in human rights. The consultation is reported to have been respectful and thorough. All relevant opinions were heard.

The dominant view that emerged from this summit was that World Rugby would have to amend its policy. It was simply too risky to continue to allow male bodies into the women’s game. The decision-makers relied on data that had been published by the renowned Karolinska Institute (Sweden) in September 2019. Even after a full year of hormonal reduction in accordance with IOC guidelines, the researchers concluded, there was no appreciable loss of mass, muscle mass, or strength in transitioning males. In physical terms, it was just a man playing with women.

World Rugby had to come to terms with reality: Irrespective of hormonal intervention, male athletes are, on average, 40 percent heavier, 15 percent faster, 30 percent more powerful, and 25-50 percent stronger than their female counterparts. And these differences pose obvious risks for female players in full-contact rugby. [...] Women’s rugby isn’t a particularly popular mass-participation sport. But because World Rugby’s proposal, if enacted, would represent one of the first big cracks in the dam for those who insist trans-identified males should be allowed to compete with women, the case has attracted plenty of lobbying.

The Canadian Women’s Sex-Based Rights group (CaWsbar) [...thanked...] World Rugby for becoming “the first world sports federation to have undertaken a thorough and balanced review...” Social-media commentary has been abundant. [...] Activist groups opposed to any reconsideration of the IOC’s rules, on the other hand, put out statements-many of them picked up by the press-with headlines suggesting that World Rugby was implementing a “ban” on trans athletes. In fact, no one would be “banned” under the proposal. Athletes would simply be required to compete with athletes of their own sex, as had been the case in rugby, and numerous other sports, until very recently.

Some observers may be tempted to conflate World Rugby’s proposal with the controversy surrounding elite runner Caster Semenya [...who...] is one of a small number of people who exhibit differences of sexual development (DSD)-“a group of congenital conditions associated with atypical development of internal and external genital structures,” as experts define it. The trans rugby players who seek to participate in women’s leagues, on the other hand, are simply biological males who have changed their pronouns and social identity.

Nevertheless, both situations highlight the tension that exists between biological determinants and human-rights claims when it comes to access to women’s sports... (MORE - details)

RELATED (The Guardian): Eddie Redmayne condemns ‘vitriol’ aimed at JK Rowling after her trans rights comments ..... TERF: Trans-Exclusionary Radical Feminist
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#2
Syne Offline
Well, I guess biological men invading all the spaces for biological women is one way for the real misogynists to "put women in their place". And that seems pretty apropos for all the leftist causes du jour.
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#3
Zinjanthropos Offline
Quote:On one occasion, a team captain was quoted as saying that their male-bodied player had “folded an opponent like a deck chair.”


Doesn’t seem to bother the females on a team unless they’re on the receiving end of a male-bodied tackle. Women enjoy seeing other women wrecked? Don’t know how males can be blamed for anything that happens when transgenders are allowed to play on female sports teams.
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#4
Ben the Donkey Offline
I don't think (biological) males are to blame either.

Society seems to have come to the conclusion that drugs in sports are verboten; unless it's the drugs consumed by the current flavour of month athletes - which are, increasingly, transgender.
If you want to get surgery to become female, fine. If you needs drugs (artificial means) to continue being female, fine.
But don't fuck with traditional sport. If you need drugs to play, then don't play (professionally). Simple as that.

I don't care much for this "self-identify" bullshit.
I can call myself Indigenous all I like (my grandmother was), but that doesn't make me Indigenous.
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#5
C C Offline
(Oct 24, 2020 04:31 PM)Ben the Donkey Wrote: [...] I don't care much for this "self-identify" bullshit.
I can call myself Indigenous all I like (my grandmother was), but that doesn't make me Indigenous.


Yah, I've got a CDIB card that officially indicates the North American version of "indigenous" and experience a dubious feeling about it.

I signed up to a tribal clinic once just to see what [American] government health care was like first hand. Immediately realized that I hadn't needed to worry about looking like an oddball intruder since there were plenty of other trivial fractional inter-racial folk there.

Customer service was actually excellent. But I did learn that one had to schedule a regular doctor's appointment 3 months in advance; and dentistry, eye-care, etc required scheduling nine months in advance. There was one advantage (sans a lengthy wait): Patients could get prescribed medications and over-the-counter products for free, no boredom unless there happened to be a long line in front of the dispensary outlet.

I never went back, especially because back then I only rarely even visited conventional clinics (with myself as the patient, anyway). Now I don't go to any at all -- can't find a doctor who'll accept me if I don't keep their regularly spaced appointments for "preventive care". Others I found in the past didn't give a flip about rogue behavior or just popping in to get a particular, lone prescription renewed -- but they're either dead old-timers or located too far away now.
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#6
Syne Offline
(Oct 24, 2020 07:40 PM)C C Wrote: I signed up to a tribal clinic once just to see what [American] government health care was like first hand.
Tribal clinics are not operated by the US government.
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#7
C C Offline
(Oct 24, 2020 09:20 PM)Syne Wrote:
(Oct 24, 2020 07:40 PM)C C Wrote: I signed up to a tribal clinic once just to see what [American] government health care was like first hand.
Tribal clinics are not operated by the US government.

Only "government" was there originally, and "American" was added later (in brackets) to pre-empt any potential passerby complaint of "But it's not like that -- I live in _X_ region, culture, country blah, blah, and it's not like that." Though despite such protests I expect there will still be general or common characteristics applicable -- which was the point.

"American" was used instead of US because it can geographically subsume either. "Native American" hasn't been nixed by Woke politics yet (IHS even still entails "Indian" in the acronym).

Tribal governments
https://system.uslegal.com/tribal-governments/


IHS Quick Look
https://www.ihs.gov/newsroom/factsheets/quicklook/

The Indian health care system presents a successful model [...] The agency’s consultation with tribal governments and its facilitation of Indian people’s involvement in policy development and agency decision making has led to their participation in setting program and budget priorities and advocating for their health needs. The agency’s consultation practices can be a model for the entire federal government.

Which is to say, the system -- even when local facilities are claimed to be run by tribal administration (sport the tribal name), still provides an example of government health care (generic concept).
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#8
confused2 Offline
Do American Indians self-identify as that .. or something else?
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#9
Syne Offline
(Oct 25, 2020 02:00 AM)confused2 Wrote: Do American Indians self-identify as that .. or something else?

Most seem to be fine with just "Indian".
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#10
C C Offline
(Oct 25, 2020 02:00 AM)confused2 Wrote: Do American Indians self-identify as that .. or something else?

My brother still claims he does it, so I check both "white" and "American Indian or Alaska Native" on questionnaires. Even though I feel kind of ersatz doing it at times. Maybe stirred by a feeling of duty with respect to the card-carrying aspect. There's much ado about some tribes being vastly undercounted during census taking (obviously isn't going change that after and apart from the fact, though).

Surprisingly, I've never run into those rez folk (as opposed to "conventional" towns or communities heavy with indigenous and inter-racial populations?) that are portrayed as openly hostile and resentful toward whites (and vice-versa) like the ones depicted in shows like "Longmire" or occasional rhetoric on television channels catering to specific population groups. Or what one hears about in the news (like South & North Dakota states, etc). As well as "fractional bloods" in forums/emails referring to being vocally deprecated by "full-bloods" for contributing too much policy input and "chiseling" in on tribal benefits (though it sounds kind of mild or potentially facetious to my interpreting mind).

But I guess that's indeed (contingently) the case. Back when I was a teen working during the summer, a fellow employee originally from Wisconsin remarked about how baffled he was at the easygoing people interactions in the state we were at. He exaggeratedly said it was still almost like the Wild West where he hailed from -- "engines and cal-bois" hating each other's guts. I found it hard to believe at the time -- despite all those (national encompassing) contemporary Hollywood depictions, news reports, PBS documentaries, etc. [Wisconsin may have altered a bit politically since then (barring Madison and its university or academic environment), but that doesn't necessarily correlate to changes in the cultural relationships he was describing applicable to the 20th-century. At that age, I'd never even pondered Native American issues being associated with certain states like that, so that was part of the "Martian talk" resonance it had for me.]
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