The information contained in light

#1
Magical Realist Offline
Contemplating the mystery of light's information carrying capacity last nite in bed. I have yet to hear from science a good explanation for it. How mere electromagnetic waves in space can carry all the information needed to reconstitute an exact image of any scene from any angle or distance for an observer. And it's not even necessary for it to enter an eye. Just hold up a lens and you can project that exact image on a blank piece of paper! How does it do this?

Wave forms only speak the language of frequency and wavelength and amplitude. They totally lack the means to so easily and accurately reproduce the exact imagery of the last thing they bounced off of. And yet they do! It's almost like light carries the memory of where it last touched matter, transmitting thruout space a seamless omni-directionally projected movie of everything around us for miles. You have only to move your position slightly and you will continue seeing this streaming projection of the same scene albeit from a slightly different spatial perspective. You can even magnify this field of light waves with a telescope or a microscope and you will see more even information contained in it. More details not even visible to our mere eyes! There's something fishy going on here. But alas I'm totally befuddled!

And here's a Reddit comment from an engineer about how light interacts with matter:

"It doesn’t actually “bounce.” Light — more generally electromagnetic radiation — interacts with the matter (it’s simpler if we limit the conversation to conductors) it impinges on by inducing currents and charge distributions. These, in turn, generate their own electromagnetic radiation. If you could somehow induce the exact same currents and charge distributions in a slab of metal as an incident beam of light, it would generate a beam of light identical to a reflected beam."

So the whole "bouncing off" metaphor is wrong. Light doesn't literally bounce off atoms. It excites them to generate their own photons, which in turn sends out a new wave of light into space we see as the image of the surface transmitting it. Matter actually glows with its own photon-stimulated light!
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#2
C C Offline
If they had equal range (not limited to subatomic spaces), it would arguably be similar with the strong and weak forces, too. Gravity does have the same ubiquity of EM, albeit far less resolution where it can only represent massive cosmological disturbances and entities.   

Gravitational wave astronomy: "Gravitational waves are minute distortions or ripples in spacetime caused by the acceleration of massive objects. They are produced by cataclysmic events such as the merger of binary black holes, the coalescence of binary neutron stars, supernova explosions and processes including those of the early universe shortly after the Big Bang. Studying them offers a new way to observe the universe, providing valuable insights into the behavior of matter under extreme conditions. Similar to electromagnetic radiation (such as light wave, radio wave, infrared radiation and X-rays) which involves transport of energy via propagation of electromagnetic field fluctuations, gravitational radiation involves fluctuations of the relatively weaker gravitational field."
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#3
Magical Realist Offline
I can understand how electromagnetic waves can encode information. It happens all the time with radios and TV and the Internet. The waveforms are basically signals embedded with all the data needed to be decoded by the appropriately tuned receiver. But that's not how light carries information. There doesn't seem to be any encoding in terms of the waveforms own characteristics. It is almost as if the light waves are recording a video of our environment around us and then playing back that video recording on our eyes. Not that light CAN'T be used to encode information. Alexander Graham Bell invented the photophone which transmitted sound thru light by vibrating a mirror. And then of course there's fiber optics too.

Joke: I retuned my transistor radio to pick up light waves instead of radio waves. When I shined a flashlight on it, all it would say was "Flashlight. Flashlight. Flashlight..."
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#4
Syne Offline
Since massless photons don't experience "travel," aside from scattering in transit, you basically get whatever the light last emitted from. The only thing each photon carries is a frequency, which we see as color. It takes may photons to make an image.
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#5
Magical Realist Offline
How does the same light wave carry different frequencies which end up as colors in the one same image? Are you saying there are separate light waves for each frequency which somehow recombine into the same geometrical pattern that is the image? And even if they are now viewed as photons instead of waves, how does a particle have a frequency?
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#6
C C Offline
(Mar 30, 2026 06:59 PM)Magical Realist Wrote: I can understand how electromagnetic waves can encode information. It happens all the time with radios and TV and the Internet. The waveforms are basically signals embedded with all the data needed to be decoded by the appropriately tuned receiver. But that's not how light carries information. There doesn't seem to be any encoding in terms of the waveforms own characteristics. It is almost as if the light waves are recording a video of our environment around us and then playing back that video recording on our eyes. Not that light CAN'T be used to encode information. Alexander Graham Bell invented the photophone which transmitted sound thru light by vibrating a mirror. And then of course there's fiber optics too. [...]

Yah, it's in its "natural state" that visible light retains the spatial organization of what it interacted with or was emanated by (as can non-visible neighboring ranges in the EM spectrum). Whereas the digital encoding of it (like in fiber optic systems) is what that renders it having to be deciphered by receiving equipment and additionally delegated to the electronic manipulations of a viewing screen to restore the original structure.

While the image imparted to an eye or camera isn't scrambled up like a Picasso painting, it can contingently be flipped horizontally or vertically by a mirror or a lens it passes through. The varying amplitudes of light waves correspond to the light and dark areas they leave or impart that constitute an overall image.
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#7
Syne Offline
(Mar 30, 2026 08:40 PM)Magical Realist Wrote: How does the same light wave carry different frequencies which end up as colors in the one same image? Are you saying there are separate light waves for each frequency which somehow recombine into the same geometrical pattern that is the image? And even if they are now viewed as photons instead of waves, how does a particle have a frequency?

It doesn't. One light wave carries one frequency/color. Images are a combination or many photons/waves, each capable of carrying a different frequency.
A photon has an energy, proportional to the frequency of its wave. Nothing is "recombined." Each moves in a geodesic "straight" line through spacetime. So aside from being scattered by intervening mass, there's nothing to disrupt the "straight line" pattern of multiple photons/waves.
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#8
Magical Realist Offline
Quote:A photon has an energy, proportional to the frequency of its wave. Nothing is "recombined." Each moves in a geodesic "straight" line through spacetime. So aside from being scattered by intervening mass, there's nothing to disrupt the "straight line" pattern of multiple photons/waves.

There's no reason all these waves, which are basically just fluctuations in the EM field, should carry an exact image or rather movie of everything it is emitted from, much less an infinitely magnifiable one. We're talking mechanical propagation of energy here--the movement of waves/particles with no mass thru space--which nevertheless seamlessly replicate an HD movie of the entire world for us in all directions and at all scales at every point in space. It just seems impossible to me that such a panoramic sea of discrete moving waves/particles all randomly dispersing outward from their points of origin can nevertheless be reconstituted by a mere glass lens or even with a mirror. That's a lot of scattered and cross-fired information if you ask me. If it didn't require a brain to be seen at all, it almost sounds like what we mean by consciousness as an instantaneously projected and transparently propagated and infinitely encompassing and quasi-perspectival movie of reality itself!
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#9
Syne Offline
Nothing is carrying a complete image. Each photon/wave is carrying one frequency. It just happens to be traveling along the same geodesic as a huge number of other photons, none of which "know" or encoded the happenstance of what they collectively project. They just happen to be traveling together.

Distance light signals are very weak. It takes significant time to absorb enough light to form a single image.

Hubble Space Telescope imaging times vary widely, ranging from a few seconds for bright, nearby objects to over 100 hours for deep-field surveys. While typical images might take minutes or hours, groundbreaking images like the Hubble Ultra-Deep Field took nearly 1 million seconds (about 11.5 days) of total exposure, assembled by stacking hundreds of individual exposures over hundreds of orbits.
- Google AI

So I'm not sure where you're getting your "movie" or "infinitely magnifiable."

There is nothing "mechanical" about massless particles, as it doesn't take any energy to accelerate them... which is why they travel at the universal speed limit.

A mechanical force is a direct physical interaction between two objects that causes a change in motion.
- Google AI

There can be no change in motion for light. As you mentioned earlier, there is no "bounce."

"randomly dispersing outward from their points of origin"?
Any light source emits photons in every direction. There's nothing random about the fact that we can intercept those photons that were emitted in our direction.
"cross-fired information"?
As I've said, the only information a photon carries is its frequency. Since photons do not generally interact with each other (they pass through each other), there is no "cross-firing."
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#10
Magical Realist Offline
Quote:As I've said, the only information a photon carries is its frequency. Since photons do not generally interact with each other (they pass through each other), there is no "cross-firing."

"Light waves interfere with each other when they overlap, creating patterns of higher intensity (constructive interference) or darkness (destructive interference). This occurs because light behaves as a wave, and when multiple waves meet, their amplitudes add together, allowing them to strengthen or cancel each other out."

Quote:There is nothing "mechanical" about massless particles, as it doesn't take any energy to accelerate them... which is why they travel at the universal speed limit.

You just said photons carry energy as frequency. I'm assuming then that waves do too. How this all happens without mass is beyond me.

Mechanics is the science of moving particles and systems of moving particles. Waves by their very definition are forms of energy moving thru space, yet supposedly without mass. How in the world can waves carry energy without mass? Energy and mass are equivalent are they not? Have ever seen those toys where 4 black blades in a vacuum bulb that spin when you shine a light in them? Some kind of force is obviously being carried by light.

Quote:So I'm not sure where you're getting "infinitely magnifiable."

A microscope and telescope are simply magnifying the light waves entering their lenses. At different scales more and more details become visible. That's another way light contains tons of information. Deep inside itself and invisibly to the naked eye. How does that happen? Waves within waves within waves?

Quote:There can be no change in motion for light.

Actually there is. It's called refraction--when light waves go from one medium to another, like water or glass.

Quote:Nothing is carrying a complete image. Each photon/wave is carrying one frequency.

The waves propagating thru the EM field carry the images, which we see with our eyes as a live action movie of what is happening around us. This movie, which is actually two movies, one for each offset eye creating the illusion of 3D, is all we ever see of the world. Just morphing light images seamlessly streamed to us from all directions at once.
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