Hegseth boat strike (Trump administration brewing)

[Syne]

Yes, Hezbollah has a significant, long-standing presence in Venezuela, using it as a strategic hub for criminal activities (drug trafficking, money laundering), fundraising, and gaining access to the U.S. and Western Hemisphere for potential terror operations, with support and infiltration within the Maduro government, according to reports from groups like RAND and the Atlantic Council.
- Google AI

[C C]

I assume this interpretation has been challenged since it first appeared a couple of days or so ago. But the suggestion still probably applies that most or many Americans don't care deeply, in sobbing terms, about foreign drug smugglers being spared from additional action. Even the old-fashioned Marxists didn't extend their belief in radical socioeconomic equality to include coddling blatant malefactors and developing other refined sensitivities. In fact, it's one of the things their propaganda engine often mocked the West about.
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THE RUBIN REPORT
https://youtu.be/QmJ9gfl0sEE

VIDEO EXCERPT: Winston, I want to go right back to the same thing I asked earlier, which is: I still think even if the two guys that didn't get killed immediately weren't going back to get drugs [as the "new" take on it proposes], and they were injured and whatever ... this is going to sound cold, I suppose. I don't care.

They were drug traffickers coming into the United States. I'm not saying ignore the procedure that Sean is talking about. But I just don't think the average American is going:
"Oh, gosh, we didn't pick up the guys who got injured while they were bringing Fentanyl to our shores." I don't think people care...

ABC News host seems disappointed ... https://youtu.be/QmJ9gfl0sEE

https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/QmJ9gfl0sEE

[Magical Realist]

I myself am often struck by this seeming apathy to the suffering or death of "others" by the Western masses, usually in the form of undocumented immigrants or Gazans or now of smugglers in fishing boats. Anonymity is always an effective way to squelch any natural human empathy for victims. But another key factor is just being brown-skinned and non-american and typifying them as "criminals" or "terrorists", as if such beings lack the necessary human qualities or dignity to deserve their respect or any basic human rights. I believe it's a subtle and culturally baked-in sort of racism, allowing humans to dehumanize the non-white others and dismissing their experiences as basically "brought on by themselves". Report the victims as "white Americans" otoh and watch the outrage.

[Syne]

Yeah, yeah. Just more criminals and terrorists to ally yourself with. 9_9
Obama made strikes on anonymous targets as well, but no one's intellectually honest enough to address that glaring inconvenience to the current lefty arguments.

[confused2]

I myself am often struck by this seeming apathy to the suffering or death of "others" by the Western masses, usually in the form of undocumented immigrants or Gazans or now of smugglers in fishing boats. Anonymity is always an effective way to squelch any natural human empathy for victims. But another key factor is just being brown-skinned and non-american and typifying them as "criminals" or "terrorists", as if such beings lack the necessary human qualities or dignity to deserve their respect or any basic human rights. I believe it's a subtle and culturally baked-in sort of racism, allowing humans to dehumanize the others and dismissing their experiences as basically "brought on by themselves". Report the victims as "white Americans" otoh and watch the outrage.

The ordinary Roman citizens were known as plebeians or plebs. Over time the plebs gained some (democratic) representation.

A while back I insulted someone - possibly on this thread - I considered apologizing but the apology would probably have been taken as more insulting than the original. In reality 'pleb' isn't an insult - just a statement of fact.

[C C]

[...] Obama made strikes on anonymous targets as well, but no one's intellectually honest enough to address that glaring inconvenience to the current lefty arguments.

There was collateral damage in the drone strikes (civilian casualties). Could be construed as "whataboutism" to reference those events. But if there are multiple precedents in the past of _X_ occurring (both Obama and Bush, and perhaps even earlier non-drone campaigns of targeting militants), then such can qualify as part of the justification, rather than being explanatory evasion. Governments that are hostile to the US may use drug smuggling as one of their few options for trying to harass an opponent (if their armed forces are too weak to intimidate, and they lack zealot terrorists willing to sacrifice their lives in suicidal bombings and shootings).

Obama’s final drone strike data
https://www.cfr.org/blog/obamas-final-drone-strike-data

As Donald Trump assumes office today [Jan 2017], he inherits a targeted killing program that has been the cornerstone of U.S. counterterrorism strategy over the past eight years. On January 23, 2009, just three days into his presidency, President Obama authorized his first kinetic military action: two drone strikes, three hours apart, in Waziristan, Pakistan, that killed as many as twenty civilians. Two terms and 540 strikes later, Obama leaves the White House after having vastly expanding and normalizing the use of armed drones for counterterrorism and close air support operations in non-battlefield settings—namely Yemen, Pakistan, and Somalia.

(2016) After 7 Years, Obama finally announces the number of people killed in drone strikes
https://archive.thinkprogress.org/after-...b751c430e/

The Obama administration finally announced on Friday the number people that have been killed in drone strikes in Pakistan, Yemen, and Africa since 2009 — shedding light on a program that has for the most part remained largely in the dark to the public.

The White House estimated that during Obama’s administration, between 64 and 116 civilians had died in drone strikes, and between 2,372 to 2,581 combatants. The deaths occurred in 473 strikes from January 20, 2009 to December 31, 2015. The number only accounts for deaths from “outside areas of active hostilities,” and thus does not include deaths from drones in Afghanistan, Iraq, or Syria, where airstrikes occur regularly. No figures were provided for those countries.

The announcement about the deaths — which occurred on a holiday weekend, likely to draw less attention to one of the most widely criticized aspects of Obama’s counterterrorism strategy — included no information on why, when, or where the deaths occurred, and according to many activists, was a serious underestimate of the number of deaths.

[Magical Realist]

Adm. Bradley testified before a congressional committee. There was no initial "kill them all" order from Hegseth, there was no secondary "no survivors" order from Hegseth, the drug runners reportedly return to the boat, they seemed to be salvaging drugs, and could have had a functioning radio with which to call in backup.

IOW, zero possible crimes from Hegseth and likely none from anyone involved in the strike.

"During Bradley’s joint briefing Thursday with leaders of the House and Senate armed services committees, he was pressed about whether Hegseth gave an order to kill everybody on board, according to one of the U.S. officials and the person familiar with the briefing. Bradley, referencing the approved list of targets, said Hegseth told him to kill everyone on board and to destroy the vessel, the official and person familiar with the briefing said."--- https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/nationa...rcna247767

[Syne]

More anonymous sources. 9_9
That's what got mud on WaPo's face.

[Magical Realist]

Before anyone talks about “bombing fishing boats” or “stopping fentanyl from Venezuela,” here are the actual facts:

? Distance:
The closest point between Venezuela and the United States is 1,073 miles.
That’s over a thousand miles of open ocean.

? Fishing boats:
A typical fishing boat would need 6–12 full tanks of fuel to even attempt that trip.
It’s not a realistic trafficking route — it’s not even physically practical.

? How much fentanyl comes from Venezuela?
Virtually none.

Venezuela is not a source country for fentanyl going into the United States.
? Where U.S. fentanyl actually comes from:
• China supplies most of the precursor chemicals
• Mexico manufactures the illicit fentanyl
• Fentanyl enters mostly through ports of entry by land, hidden in vehicles — not fishing boats

So the idea that Venezuelan fishing boats are flooding the U.S. with fentanyl is not just wrong — it’s physically impossible.

If we want to solve the fentanyl crisis, we have to start with facts, not myths.

[Syne]

Ahem:

Yes, Hezbollah has a significant, long-standing presence in Venezuela, using it as a strategic hub for criminal activities (drug trafficking, money laundering), fundraising, and gaining access to the U.S. and Western Hemisphere for potential terror operations, with support and infiltration within the Maduro government, according to reports from groups like RAND and the Atlantic Council.
- Google AI

Venezuelan drug smuggling is funding actual terrorists... by any definition.