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Magical Realist
Apr 7, 2025 06:57 PM
A question provoking some thought as a whole array of possibilities comes to mind. But overall, in my estimation, the greatest threat to our species is simply universal indifference. It is the trend seen even in our own time towards a complete lack of interest or concern about anything, having much to do with our being constantly bombarded and jerked around by this thing and that.
While electronic media has served us well in its providing us instantaneous awareness of events and ideas, it also has reinforced the view of ourselves as the detached spectator, never really involved with what we are experiencing but instead feeding on a mental diet of mass-produced memes and cliches and opinions.
This subtle depersonalization of our consciousness by what is average and common and abstract to us personally creates the illusion over time that nothing is really important because everything is important. The only standard for importance is if it can be talked and opined about. We lose any vested interest in anything happening eventually--one trite thing followed by another in an endless and recycling anti-discourse of soundbytes and pithy one-liners.
Doomed to a zombie existence of repeated reports and pre-filtered news, nothing involves us anymore because nothing CAN involve us. Apathy becomes the inevitable result, lives trapped in the illusion that nothing really matters and nothing will ever matter.
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stryder
Sep 17, 2025 11:40 AM
Pete(Fairer),
It goes beyond just programming, programs run in an environment and the environment has rules. If you try to create a program in such manner in some environments it would only have a limited effectiveness as it might be cause for being recursive. If it's not caught for recursiveness it could lead to a system running out of resources to support it, which would brick the program overall.
So any metaphorical attachment you have to how the execution of that code is, is broken (much like the pseudocode).
I hope one day you can grow beyond your nonsensical musings that don't relate to anything and post more coherently. AI's got to the point it can do it now, but your still lagging behind.
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Zinjanthropos
Sep 25, 2025 02:11 PM
(This post was last modified: Sep 25, 2025 02:35 PM by Zinjanthropos.)
Evolution of lying/bullshitting. How much time does one waste because of it in a lifetime? AI:
Quote: Based on evolutionary and psychological research, humans did not evolve explicitly to be "bullshitters," but rather developed complex social and communication skills that can be co-opted for deception and self-deception. The ability to lie is an evolutionary byproduct of cognitive advancements, not its primary purpose.
The evolution of lying
While the ability to deliberately mislead others is a component of sophisticated communication, deception itself exists throughout the animal kingdom. However, the human capacity for lying and "bullshitting" is unique due to our advanced social and cognitive abilities.
Simple deception: Many animals use deception for a competitive advantage, such as camouflaging themselves or faking injuries to protect their young.
Complex communication: The emergence of complex human language, likely between 50,000 and 150,000 years ago, was a major turning point. It allowed for the instruction of imagination and the development of complex social relationships, which fundamentally changed the nature of deception.
The lie and the language: According to some theories, lying and language co-evolved in a "never-ending co-evolutionary spiral". The development of language enhanced the capacity for deception, which in turn created selection pressures for better lie detection and more complex language.
The social function of deception
In addition to gaining a competitive advantage, lying and bullshit serve important social functions within human groups.
Navigating a social world: As social groups grew larger and more complex, our ancestors needed better ways to manage their relationships and reputations. Gossip and social judgment became critical for regulating behavior and maintaining group cohesion. Deception and "bullshitting" became tools for navigating these intricate dynamics.
Self-deception for social gain: Evolutionary psychologists argue that humans evolved the ability to deceive themselves in order to better deceive others. By unconsciously convincing ourselves of a false reality, we can project more confidence and avoid the cognitive load and "tells" associated with intentional lying. This self-deception can minimize consequences if the lie is exposed.
Building trust: Deception is a "relational phenomenon" that depends on an underlying assumption of trust. The very existence of lies in a cooperative society proves that there is a baseline expectation of honesty that can be exploited.
Bullshit vs. lying
The philosopher Harry Frankfurt, in his essay On Bullshit, draws a clear distinction between lying and bullshitting, which has relevance in an evolutionary context.
The liar: A liar knows the truth and intentionally seeks to conceal it. This requires an active engagement with reality.
The bullshitter: A bullshitter has no regard for the truth and simply seeks to persuade or impress others with a careless disregard for the facts. According to Frankfurt, this is more dangerous to society because it erodes the very value of truth.
While the human ability for deception may be an evolutionary development, the prevalence of "bullshitting" in modern society is arguably a consequence of living in a world of complex and often opaque information, where the truth can be ignored more easily than it can be verified.
Would it stand to reason that AI, being a product of mankind, is full of it also?
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