Life After Death

(Nov 13, 2016 04:34 PM)Carol Wrote: Well,  empirical information is off topic, but things are slow so maybe we can make something good out of it?  The word obviously comes from "empire" and speaks of the days of old when people thought it was by God's will that the empire has absolute power.  

I am okay with a belief in God, but I am opposed to God of Abraham mythology.  The masses accepting those religions in the past makes sense, but it is hard to understand why these beliefs still have mass appeal?  

So how much have you paid attention to messages from the deceased, such as a last visit from a deceased loved one?  Have you ever had an experience like that?  I am going on the notion that the forum is causal and especially this part of it is for weird things.  I was the thinking the goal here is to have fun.  Do you think there is life after death?  As I said, I am not sure but I wonder if it is possible.

Empirical evidence is never off-topic unless you are specifically discussing works of fiction, art, etc.. And no, the origin of "empirical" isn't empire.

When empirical first appeared as an adjective in English, it meant simply "in the manner of an empiric." An empiric was a member of an ancient sect of doctors who practiced medicine based exclusively on experience, as contrasted with those who relied on theory or philosophy. The name empiric derives from Latin empiricus, itself from Greek empeirikos ("experienced"). It ultimately traces back to the verb peiran, meaning "to try, attempt, or experiment." - http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/empirical

Empire has a different Latin origin.

Middle English, from Anglo-French empire, empirie, from Latin imperium absolute authority, empire, from imperare to command - http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/empire

"Paid attention to" would seem to imply that you have to actively seek out these "messages from the deceased". That would suggest that you have to be psychologically primed before you're likely to experience any, whether by grief, sympathy with similar stories of others, subconscious danger cues, etc..

I think there is an afterlife or sorts, but that the deceased have absolutely no interest in their former life.

Thank you for an interesting post.

My experience leads me to believe if there is an afterlife, those folks do have an interest in what is happening to loved ones. Notice I said "if". My mind is not made up. I agree what we believe about someone from the other side attempting to communicate with us, probably depends on if we have read of heard of such things. But in a quantum physics show, it was said we may not perceive a ship in the water if we have no reason to know of ships. Maybe we miss a lot of things we are not prepared to notice?

Quantum physics does not support the idea that we would fail to perceive real things if we lacked previous knowledge of them.

Carol....what about the reverse? An afterdeath? Perhaps this isn't life we're experiencing, we're currently existing in an afterlife? Call it reincarnation, although I couldn't say where you had previously lived, nor could I tell you who or what you once were. Wouldn't that be something, all of us already living an afterlife, here on Earth of all places. Possibly on occasion we get consecutive terms on this planet. Oh, and maybe the process has repeated itself in perpetuity across aeons of time and the vastness of this and many other universes. As a result every life experienced would actually be one of many afterlives of an original life form, whatever that was. Next topic...hypnotic regression.

There is that. If there is an afterlife where the deceased do still care about this world, what would keep them from coming back, in new bodies? If a "fresh" soul can adhere to a new body, why not any other soul? After all, a soul is a soul....and the process may induce an amnesia that accounts for not remembering the last life.

Spanos' research leads him to the conclusion that past lives are not memories, but actually social constructions based on patients acting "as if" they were someone else, but with significant flaws that would not be expected of actual memories. To create these memories, Spanos' subjects drew upon the expectations established by authority figures and information outside of the experiment such as television, novels, life experiences and their own desires. - wiki

(Nov 14, 2016 04:50 AM)Syne Wrote:  After all, a soul is a soul....and the process may induce an amnesia that accounts for not remembering the last life.

Hard drive emptied into a database then installed in another machine. The soul is nothing but a hard drive? Sounds like a purpose, but who or what benefits and why?

The correct computer analogy would be that the soul is BKAC, and yes, those are interchangeable...and typically forget what they've learned from one computer to the next.

(Nov 14, 2016 01:29 AM)Syne Wrote: Quantum physics does not support the idea that we would fail to perceive real things if we lacked previous knowledge of them.

I thought the idea strange, but I am sure that is what was said in the movie "What the Bleep Do We Know".  They said the natives did not see the ships because ships were unknown.  I don't know, but a dog or other animal would probably not register a ship as something to pay attention to.  Heck, my dog is not mindful at all of moving things.  But I expect a human to be curious, but maybe not?

(Nov 14, 2016 05:11 PM)Carol Wrote:

(Nov 14, 2016 01:29 AM)Syne Wrote: Quantum physics does not support the idea that we would fail to perceive real things if we lacked previous knowledge of them.

I thought the idea strange, but I am sure that is what was said in the movie "What the Bleep Do We Know".  They said the natives did not see the ships because ships were unknown.  I don't know, but a dog or other animal would probably not register a ship as something to pay attention to.  Heck, my dog is not mindful at all of moving things.  But I expect a human to be curious, but maybe not?

Didn't see the show but if the ship had sounded a loud horn, rang a bell or fired their cannons.....the natives would not have heard?

(Nov 14, 2016 04:30 AM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: Carol....what about the reverse? An afterdeath? Perhaps this isn't life we're experiencing, we're currently existing in an afterlife? Call it reincarnation, although I couldn't say where you had previously lived, nor could I tell you who or what you once were. Wouldn't that be something, all of us already living an afterlife, here on Earth of all places. Possibly on occasion we get consecutive terms on this planet. Oh, and maybe the process has repeated itself in perpetuity across aeons of time and the vastness of this and many other universes. As a result every life experienced would actually be one of many afterlives of an original life form, whatever that was. Next topic...hypnotic regression.

I have my reaons for believing this is possible, only my sense of it is that we are part of the planets where our lives begin?  It is hard for me to imagine beyond earth.  I am still worried about getting into terrible here because my thoughts on these subjects most certainly is not empirical!  Also I am not confident of my thoughts being anything more than imagination.  However, I love exploring unual possibilities and I am sure that is an important part of science.  Eisenstien said imagination is important.  But just because we think something doesn't make it so.  These forums seem open to the exploration of the unusal, for the pure fun of it, but my previous experience in science forums, is people in these forums take themselves VERY SERIOUSLY and tend to be intolerant of anything that doesn't fit their idea of good science.  

  Has everyone seen Inside/Out the movie about emotions?  The baby refuses to eat broccoli and this is a demonstration of how the feeling Disgust protects us from unknown dangers.  That feeling comes up for me a lot when I read something that doesn't seem right to me.     And with my curiousity and reading, that comes up often.  But our history should make everyone aware that this emotional reaction to the unknown has been a barrier to science, and heck it is also an uptight attitude that can ruin the fun of exploration.  That is why I am here and not with another science forum.  I am looking for fun and want to play with ideas.     Okay 

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(Nov 14, 2016 05:17 PM)Zinjanthropos Wrote:

(Nov 14, 2016 05:11 PM)Carol Wrote:

(Nov 14, 2016 01:29 AM)Syne Wrote: Quantum physics does not support the idea that we would fail to perceive real things if we lacked previous knowledge of them.

I thought the idea strange, but I am sure that is what was said in the movie "What the Bleep Do We Know".  They said the natives did not see the ships because ships were unknown.  I don't know, but a dog or other animal would probably not register a ship as something to pay attention to.  Heck, my dog is not mindful at all of moving things.  But I expect a human to be curious, but maybe not?

Didn't see the show but if the ship had sounded a loud horn, rang a bell or fired their cannons.....the natives would not have heard?

Now there is a good question.  That is what I like.  As I said it is hard to believe anyone would not see a ship, but that might be possible?  Sounds however, some good studies have been done on our reaction to sounds, and our reaction to sounds is pretty universal, including shared with animals.  Irritating sounds are almost always a warning.  However dogs are limited in the sounds they make so their bark can be saying "hello" or a warning.   A couple of barks maybe a hello and many barks is a warning.  An explosion is like thunder or a limb breaking,and that is danger.  Dogs can be trained to associate food with a bell and this is getting totally off topic- but we do associate some sounds with the dead trying to get our attention, such as a knock on the door, and no one is there or the phone ringing and no one is there, or lights flickering.