Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5

Glorious victories of trans athletes are shaking up sports

#1
C C Offline
https://www.wired.com/story/the-glorious...up-sports/

EXCERPT: At all levels of sport [...transgender athletes are...] stepping onto the podium and into the headlines. ... These recent performances are inherently praiseworthy—shining examples of what humans can accomplish with training and effort. But as more transgender athletes rise to the top of their fields, some vocal opponents are also expressing outrage at what they see as transgender athletes ruining sports for cisgendered girls and women.

These issues have come to a head in Connecticut [...] In Connecticut, as in more than a dozen other states, high school athletes are allowed to compete in the category that matches their gender identity. According to ADF legal counsel Christiana Holcomb, two transgender athletes—Miller and another runner, Andraya Yearwood—“have amassed 15 different state championship titles that were once held by nine different girls across the state.”

[...] Nowhere are the debates around transgender rights as stark as they are in sports, where the temptation to draw a hard biological line has run up against the limits of what science can offer. The outcome, at least so far, is an inconsistent mix of rules that leaves almost nothing resolved.

[...] Transgender women’s performances generally decline as their testosterone does. But not every male advantage ... Some advantages, such as their bigger bone structure, greater lung capacity, and larger heart size remain, says Alison Heather, a physiologist ... Testosterone also promotes muscle memory—an ability to regain muscle mass after a period of detraining—by increasing the number of nuclei in muscles, and these added nuclei don’t go away. So transgender women have a heightened ability to build strength even after they transition, Heather says.

[...] One way to address these issues, Heather and her colleagues wrote in an essay ... would be to create a handicap system that uses an algorithm to account for physiological parameters ... Another approach would be to create a third category for people who don’t fit neatly into the male/female dichotomy (including intersex people, who are born with a mix of male and female traits). ...

[...] For all the hand-wringing about transgender women ruining women’s sport, so far there’s little evidence of that happening. ... Helen Carroll is a LGBTQ sports advocate ... she estimates there are somewhere in the neighborhood of 150 to 200 transgender athletes currently competing in NCAA sports. Most of them “you don’t hear a thing about,” she says, because their participation hasn’t caused controversy. Sport can be a life-saver for transgender people, who are at high risk of suicide, Carroll says.

[...] Even basic notions of a level playing field aren’t easy to codify. Which means that at some point the question of who is a woman becomes a cultural inquiry: How athletically outstanding can a girl or woman be before we no longer see her as female? (MORE - details)
Reply
#2
Syne Offline
You really think that genetic advantage disadvantaging real women is "glorious", CC? Why did you decide to title this from the link, when the article itself doesn't use that language? Click bait? Shame.
Reply
#3
C C Offline
(Nov 9, 2019 05:27 PM)Syne Wrote: You really think that genetic advantage disadvantaging real women is "glorious", CC? Why did you decide to title this from the link, when the article itself doesn't use that language? Click bait? Shame.

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/tr...res-story/

Just in case NR changes or removes that it turn eventually, the intro reads, for the record: Headline writing is a fine art. Wired is not very good at it. “The Glorious Victories of Trans Athletes Are Shaking Up Sports,” reads the headline. The deck: “Some critics claim transgender athletes are ruining competition for cis women and girls, but they forget: Sports—and life—have never been fair.”
Reply
#4
Syne Offline
So, they changed the headline since 11 hours ago?
Reply
#5
Zinjanthropos Offline
White vs Black athleticism, same thing? Don’t read much on that topic anymore.
Reply
#6
C C Offline
(Nov 9, 2019 06:18 PM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: White vs Black athleticism, same thing? Don’t read much on that topic anymore.


Be careful along that cliff edge. It's [inconsistently] forbidden to attribute above-average positive properties to a population group, just as with the opposite. Wink

That's one thing about sports (especially the team-based ones). It literally overcame its own internal prejudices because it usually entails assessment in terms of performance rather than sympathy and social equity head-starts, handicapping, "everybody receives a medal", etc. Back in the '50s and '60s, if "you wuz a gettin' whupped by colleges and pro clubs recruiting or drafting _X_ athletes, then you better forget that bigotry #### preventing you from doing the same".
Reply
#7
Zinjanthropos Offline
(Nov 9, 2019 06:55 PM)C C Wrote:
(Nov 9, 2019 06:18 PM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: White vs Black athleticism, same thing? Don’t read much on that topic anymore.


Be careful along that cliff edge. It's [inconsistently] forbidden to attribute above-average positive properties to a population group, just as with the opposite. Wink

Too hot a topic. Especially when people start bringing physiological and/or genetics into it. I watch a lot of sports which probably would affect my opinion so in the interest of reduced volatility.....how about black rapper vs white rapper? Wink I listen to neither as a rule but occasionally come across it in my travels. Personally I can’t tell if rapper is b or w by the sound. All sounds the same.  Rolleyes
Reply
#8
C C Offline
(Nov 9, 2019 07:29 PM)Zinjanthropos Wrote:
(Nov 9, 2019 06:55 PM)C C Wrote:
(Nov 9, 2019 06:18 PM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: White vs Black athleticism, same thing? Don’t read much on that topic anymore.

Be careful along that cliff edge. It's [inconsistently] forbidden to attribute above-average positive properties to a population group, just as with the opposite. Wink

Too hot a topic. Especially when people start bringing physiological and/or genetics into it. I watch a lot of sports which probably would affect my opinion so in the interest of reduced volatility.....how about black rapper vs white rapper? Wink I listen to neither as a rule but occasionally come across it in my travels. Personally I can’t tell if rapper is b or w by the sound. All sounds the same.  Rolleyes

You've introduced an interesting historical analogy, though. Apart from maybe the alt-right, nobody would be giving white (plus cis) female athletes the time of day if they were whining about something in that territory.

That may well become a reference perspective in the future for just letting the situation be as it is. Although the interpretative similarity or strained conflation (whether wrongly or rightly) with the controversy of artificial enhancement in sports may always vex it. Back in the 70s and 80s, naive Olympic officials originally ignored the complaints from US athletes that doping was transpiring with East German athletes (latter girls speaking with deep voices in the shower rooms and so forth), before belatedly taking the issue seriously.

But again, it doesn't fit well since "cheating" to win trophies (in this case via lingering, biological male characteristics inserted into a female categorized division) is not a motivation for going trans. It would be rather incredible if the majority of participants underwent radical physiological changes for the sake of that. Not absolute, since any group of humans can have a small percentage of genuine nuts -- but that shouldn't dictate policy about the majority.
Reply
#9
Yazata Online
In this case, the author was addressing a hot-button issue that many on the cultural left probably don't want discussed or questioned. So the author or editor probably felt the need to signal that they (and their magazine) were still virtuous and politically/culturally correct.

Feminist activists and gay activists have been at each other's throats over this and its gotten very ugly. So there's perceived danger in writing about it at all. Anyone who does is probably going to virtue-signal like crazy.

(Nov 9, 2019 05:55 AM)C C Wrote: https://www.wired.com/story/the-glorious...up-sports/

EXCERPT:  At all levels of sport [...transgender athletes are...] stepping onto the podium and into the headlines. ... These recent performances are inherently praiseworthy—shining examples of what humans can accomplish with training and effort.

Maybe, maybe not. I'm not sure that we would be praising adults that get an unfair advantage by competing in children's athletic competitions or able-bodied competitors competing in the Special Olympics.

Quote:But as more transgender athletes rise to the top of their fields, some vocal opponents are also expressing outrage at what they see as transgender athletes ruining sports for cisgendered girls and women.

It seems to me that the whole point of having separate male and female sports is based on BIOLOGICAL sex difference. It's to make competition more fair.

If (biological) men are allowed to compete in women's sports provided only that they dress in drag, then women's sports will turn into the men's junior-varsity. As we are already seeing, they will win a disproportionate number of (ostensibly) "womens" sports championships. And of course, the women who don't like it will be silenced and denounced as "bigots" if they say anything.

Quote:[...] Nowhere are the debates around transgender rights as stark as they are in sports, where the temptation to draw a hard biological line has run up against the limits of what science can offer. The outcome, at least so far, is an inconsistent mix of rules that leaves almost nothing resolved.

I don't agree with that. There isn't this huge category of people for whom the biological definitions of male and female fail to apply. On the cellular level there are the sex chromosomes. On the phenotypic level, there's whether or not a person has testes or ovaries. Certainly there are people with XXY chromosomes, but these usually present phenotypically as males. (They may be sterile though and will be smaller and less muscular than typical males.) And there are babies born with ambiguous secondary sex characteristics, due to hormonal problems in-utero.

But... taken together and combined, all of these unfortunate hermaphroditic individuals who might legitimately be called biologically intersex are something like .05% of the population. They are people with serious developmental abnormalities, they aren't magically a whole new sex (or "gender") alongside male and female. Nor do they justify redefining biological sex as "gender" and replacing biology with 'whatever somebody feels like being'.
Reply


Possibly Related Threads…
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Article Explaining sports fandom (philosophy of sports) C C 0 7 Apr 12, 2024 04:22 PM
Last Post: C C
  Article US would bar full ban on trans athletes but allow exceptions (sports) C C 0 57 Apr 7, 2023 02:28 AM
Last Post: C C
  JK Rowling blasts trans activists for attacking feminist protester (Ninja sports) C C 0 38 May 16, 2022 07:29 PM
Last Post: C C
  South Dakota bans trans girls, women from sports teams + Love of nature is heritable C C 2 92 Feb 8, 2022 12:41 AM
Last Post: Syne
  Time has come to surrender "woman" to applicable transgender athletes (sarcasm) C C 4 128 Jun 21, 2021 11:28 PM
Last Post: Syne
  UM study finds diverse diet as effective as sports supplements for female athletes C C 0 160 Apr 19, 2020 04:57 AM
Last Post: C C
  Good news for even "verbal-only" trans boys wanting to dominate girl sports + MORE C C 7 572 May 26, 2019 08:01 PM
Last Post: Syne
  Chess grandmasters show the same longevity advantage as elite athletes C C 4 1,438 May 26, 2018 07:19 PM
Last Post: Syne
  Ancient Women Did Majority of Manual Labor, Were Stronger Than Modern Athletes C C 1 454 Dec 3, 2017 07:18 AM
Last Post: Syne
  Concussions in women athletes: Rates, symptoms & recovery are different C C 0 384 Sep 7, 2017 03:53 AM
Last Post: C C



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)