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NATO is in danger - Printable Version +- Scivillage.com Casual Discussion Science Forum (https://www.scivillage.com) +-- Forum: Culture (https://www.scivillage.com/forum-49.html) +--- Forum: Communities & Social Networking (https://www.scivillage.com/forum-57.html) +--- Thread: NATO is in danger (/thread-20160.html) Pages:
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NATO is in danger - Syne - Apr 10, 2026
NATO is in far bigger danger than anyone realizes. And the reason has nothing to do with defense budgets. RE: NATO is in danger - stryder - Apr 10, 2026 (Apr 10, 2026 07:43 AM)Syne Wrote: What a load of self actualising horseshit. If someone is going to go to great lengths to write up on a subject, they should at least do the research on the subject they pick. The problem is this is the usual low quality crap that gets posted on social networks and even finds its way getting posted to research sites etc. It should stop, but since dumb people exist it continues. For the prospect of research sake, did the writer ever leave his home state (ever or) to actually visit Europe? Have they ever been to any of the countries? It's made out to be "Funded by Americans" what they don't mention is how many years the "Borrowed" funds paid back revenue to the US in an increased amount. It's part of the reason that the US had a great deal of economic stability for decades, at least until the borrowed amounts were paid back. The problem is there is only so long you can squeeze the same citrus fruit and expect to get a cordial from it. RE: NATO is in danger - Syne - Apr 10, 2026 Notice how the European doesn't actually rebut any point in the OP. The OP didn't claim Europe didn't repay anything. But it does make the point that Europe has never paid for US protection since WWII.
Between 1946 and the early 1960s, European nations repaid a portion of the over $44.5 billion in US aid (loans and grants) received post-WWII. While over 90% of Marshall Plan aid was grants, not requiring repayment, loans were repaid over decades, often at low-interest rates. West Germany repaid one-third of its assistance. Yep, Europe's managed decline has been going on for a long time. Can't get much out of failing societies. RE: NATO is in danger - confused2 - Apr 10, 2026 I don't think it matters why the average American thinks what it thinks .. the result is the same. Whether it is the resentment a parent feels for the child that is lazy and selfish or just the knowledge that the Trump-Kennedy Memorial Centre is mocked 'everywhere' - it makes no difference. RE: NATO is in danger - Magical Realist - Apr 10, 2026 I see these diatribes all the time on Facebook. And they all have the feel of being AI generated. Which totally makes sense. I don't believe any American has such resentment and hate for our European brothers and sisters. And the need to bombastically over-justify it all speaks volumes, like it didn't know when to quit. RE: NATO is in danger - C C - Apr 10, 2026 Ironically, globalism was a kind of bribery introduced by the US in order get and ensure most of the world stayed on its side. The US provided the security and aid, and in return Europe (and the rest) offered their loyalty as partners. That's why they're befuddled by Trump's demands that sycophancy is no longer sufficient. Or, it's been so long that the original deal and exchange of benefits has faded in memory for all parties concerned. (Certainly for Trump, as he was grumbling about the one-way street nature of it way back in the 1980s, on television appearances.) Or the old Cold War situation is just too passé now. Globalism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Globalism#Concept By the late 1940s, the modern concept of globalism was formed in the United States. In their position of unprecedented power, US planners formulated policies to shape the kind of postwar world they wanted, which in economic terms meant a globe-spanning capitalist order centered exclusively upon the United States. This was the period when its global power was at its peak: the United States was the greatest economic power the world had known, with the greatest military machine in history. In February 1948, George F. Kennan's Policy Planning Staff said: "[W]e have about 50% of the world's wealth but only 6.3% of its population. ... Our real task in the coming period is to devise a pattern of relationships which will permit us to maintain this position of disparity." America's allies and foes in Eurasia were still recovering from World War II at this time. Historian James Peck has described this version of globalism as "visionary globalism". Per Peck, this was a far-reaching conception of "American-centric state globalism using capitalism as a key to its global reach, integrating everything that it can into such an undertaking". This included global economic integration, which had collapsed under World War I and the Great Depression. - - - - - - - - - AI: After WWII, the United States took on the responsibility of protecting global shipping lanes, which was crucial for international trade and security. In return, many nations became allies, benefiting from U.S. naval power to ensure the safety of their maritime commerce. The U.S. strategy of ensuring free navigation has led to a more interconnected world, where countries can trade freely without the fear of maritime disruptions. This approach has solidified the U.S. position as a leader in global affairs and has encouraged other nations to collaborate in maintaining maritime security. - - - - - - - - - Globalization After WWII https://www.shortform.com/blog/globalization-after-wwii/ The US, with its geographic protections and abundant natural resources, emerged from World War II as the only remaining country with a robust economy, a functioning industrial sector, and a strong military. Zeihan says that, instead of asserting itself as an empire, the US used its advantage to create a new world order—one aimed at isolating and economically strangling the Soviet Union. The US offered the world a deal: Align against the Soviet Union, and in return, the US would become the world’s police to ensure that international trade could flourish—except in the Soviet bloc. (Shortform note: Though the alliance Zeihan describes is often remembered as a struggle between communism and capitalism, the US government was willing to cooperate with communist nations so long as they were aligned against the Soviet Union. Specifically, the US maintained economic and diplomatic ties with communist governments in Yugoslavia, Somalia, and China at various points during the Cold War. This suggests the conflict was less about opposing communism and more about opposing the Soviets and their allies.) Zeihan asserts that, during this period, we’ve lived in an era of unprecedented economic growth and stability facilitated by the US’s commitment to protecting worldwide trade and transportation. As a result, many previously undeveloped countries were able to industrialize rapidly and join the global market. These formerly agrarian nations now house a growing number of their people in cities, where power, water, and food must be sourced from elsewhere. To date, that’s been comparatively easy, since for over 70 years, the US Navy has safeguarded global shipping. - - - - - - - - - - Globalism refers to the ideology and understanding of the interconnectedness of the modern world, while globalization is the process of increasing or decreasing that interconnectedness. Globalism can be seen as the underlying framework, whereas globalization describes the dynamic changes in global interactions. RE: NATO is in danger - Syne - Apr 10, 2026 Leftists love modern globalism. So it's no wonder they fail to see the discrepancy between Europeans crowing their superiority while being completely unable to defend themself, whether militarily or even culturally... as they import cultures antithetical to Western values. RE: NATO is in danger - confused2 - Apr 10, 2026 Syne Wrote:Europeans crowing their superioritySomething a bit odd going on there. The Kennedy Memorial Centre was a thing .. Trump rebranded it .. could be the Hooters Memorial Centre now. Can't blame Europeans for that. RE: NATO is in danger - Magical Realist - Apr 10, 2026 Quote:as they import cultures antithetical to Western values. "Western values" is a dogwhistle for white judeo-christian supremacism. RE: NATO is in danger - confused2 - Apr 11, 2026 (Apr 10, 2026 11:59 PM)Magical Realist Wrote:That explains it - thanks.Quote:as they import cultures antithetical to Western values."Western values" is a dogwhistle for white judeo-christian supremacism. |