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+--- Thread: On Karma (/thread-15044.html)
On Karma - Magical Realist - Dec 1, 2023
Do you believe in Karma, in the general sense of people getting what they deserve in the end? It seems to me one does not have to be religious to agree with this principle. I find myself uttering such phrases like "Payback's a bitch." and "What goes around comes around." at appropriate moments. I guess based on that I do believe in karma, even though I have no empirical grounds for doing so. It's like superstitions--beliefs subconsciously ingrained in our psyche that predate our 21st century modern scientific ego consciousness.
RE: On Karma - Secular Sanity - Dec 2, 2023
Not so much, but "No good deed goes unpunished"...maybe.
RE: On Karma - C C - Dec 2, 2023
(Dec 1, 2023 11:48 PM)Magical Realist Wrote: Do you believe in Karma, in the general sense of people getting what they deserve in the end? It seems to me one does not have to be religious to agree with this principle. I find myself uttering such phrases like "Payback's a bitch." and "What goes around comes around." at appropriate moments. I guess based on that I do believe in karma, even though I have no empirical grounds for doing so. It's like superstitions--beliefs subconsciously ingrained in our psyche that predate our 21st century modern scientific ego consciousness.
Well, what we do now and have done in the past does affect our future. And constructive behavior will usually yield better outcomes than its opposite.
But it's not absolute, it's sort of a percentages game rather than a form of "moral causality". A person can do all the right things that might often produce good results, but have that derailed by an accident, a chance encounter with lunatics or malefactors, by trusting the wrong people, by marrying the wrong individual, etc.
And occasionally someone who engages in a lot of misconduct and unconstructive behavior can still reap the "good life" due to having excellent scheming abilities and social skills that are used to maneuver others to accommodate their self-interests and excuse their crimes. Still, it may eventually catch up to them with a price to pay in the end.
Also, when "devastating bad luck" does strike a person who is well-liked due to positive deeds and other factors, there tends to be a safety-net of friends, family, neighbors, working colleagues and buisness associates (and so-forth) that help them to recover. ("It's A Wonderful Life" endings do happen, but so do their counterparts.)
Beliefs like "karma" and whatever variations in other cultural systems may haved served as an adequate substitute in the past for scientific views of causation. Perhaps they're still actually better as far as moral context goes. Because just looking at how evolution endorses every strategy from cooperation to exploitation/theft to deception to killing (if it works in _X_ circumstance) -- that's hardly inspiring in terms of ethical conduct. Rational arguments concocted to put a spin on Nature's ways -- to replace the "feel-good" superstitious rotes of old, may be more difficult for some intellects to apprehend or find appealing (especially when young and experienced).
RE: On Karma - Syne - Dec 2, 2023
Given the evidence in the world, of evil people doing well, I doubt you can seriously believe in karma without a belief in some form of afterlife, where imbalances in this life could possibly be rectified.
RE: On Karma - Magical Realist - Dec 7, 2023
An absolutely horrible incident occurred the other day here in Portland that has me ashamed of my prior karmic speculations. A 6 year boy old was staying at a neighbor's house and went into the garage where the two dogs were being kept (great dane and mastif mix). The dogs attacked the boy, mauling him and killing him. The lady who owned the dogs tried to make them stop but was attacked too and only injured. It's events like this that make me rethink karma and certainly a loving god. Absolutely senseless and meaningless tragedy!
RE: On Karma - C C - Dec 7, 2023
(Dec 7, 2023 08:45 PM)Magical Realist Wrote: An absolutely horrible incident occurred the other day here in Portland that has me ashamed of my prior karmic speculations. A 6 year boy old was staying at a neighbor's house and went into the garage where the two dogs were being kept (great dane and mastif mix). The dogs attacked the boy, mauling him and killing him. The lady who owned the dogs tried to make them stop but was attacked too and only injured. It's events like this that make me rethink karma and certainly a loving god. Absolutely senseless and meaningless tragedy!
Nothing unique, though. Young children are killed in wars, gang violence, etc all the time. In the old days, so many children died from sickness that large families were a requirement to keep humankind going.
I suppose karma superstition would justify it as that particular experiential continuum (soul or whatever) having done such criminal things in the previous life, that it received a quick payback in this one.
But if no information and influences of former lives are actually retained by the experiential continuum when it shifts to a new physical identity, then the consequences (bad or good) are unjustifiable.
RE: On Karma - Magical Realist - Dec 7, 2023
It seems terribly self-serving to believe all children who die were murderers or serial killers in their previous lives. Not to mention consciously continuous with that former existence such that they could learn some lesson from their untimely fate. It just seems so contrived and avoidant, stubbornly preserving for ourselves a belief of karmic justice in a universe where often there just isn't any.
RE: On Karma - confused2 - Dec 8, 2023
Quote:A 6 year boy old was staying at a neighbor's house and went into the garage where the two dogs were being kept (great dane and mastif mix).Most people in the UK would see this as a disaster waiting to happen .. yet in the US there seems to be a "What could possibly go wrong?" attitude without any concept of what could actually go wrong. Is the difference (maybe) due to faith in god or is it something else?
RE: On Karma - Syne - Dec 8, 2023
Free will includes the negligence of the dog owner and the rearing of the child. A loving God has nothing to do with either.
RE: On Karma - Magical Realist - Dec 8, 2023
(Dec 8, 2023 01:19 AM)Syne Wrote: Free will includes the negligence of the dog owner and the rearing of the child. A loving God has nothing to do with either.
How is negligence freewill? And what happened to the freewill of the child?