Scivillage.com Casual Discussion Science Forum - Being as the primary characteristic of all things

All that we see in the material world has form and function. But what if the material world is the illusion as indicated by separation?

We are forced to adopt an holistic view of reality that contains the illusion of difference within it. The idea that the mind is fundamental is nothing new. This affords us a perspective of oneness. There would be a Platonic ideal of no form from which the material reality is born. This I concede is the most correct and concise view. An "ultra-mind" would perform most efficiently allowing it access to the God realm. But most of us lack such high performance and must therefore rely upon paltry ability. I am not insulting anyone, just saying Cynicism is rampant in the world today and from this angle we may see how the ordinary person has no access to higher realms.

(Jan 12, 2020 02:26 AM)Ostronomos Wrote: [ -> ]All that we see in the material world has form and function. But what if the material world is the illusion as indicated by separation?

We are forced to adopt an holistic view of reality that contains the illusion of difference within it. The idea that the mind is fundamental is nothing new. This affords us a perspective of oneness. There would be a Platonic ideal of no form from which the material reality is born. This I concede is the most correct and concise view. An "ultra-mind" would perform most efficiently allowing it access to the God realm. But most of us lack such high performance and must therefore rely upon paltry ability. I am not insulting anyone, just saying Cynicism is rampant in the world today and from this angle we may see how the ordinary person has no access to higher realms.

The problem with such a radical homogeneous view of reality is that one inevitably relies on a world view with more than one singular element at it's core. For instance, you are alluding to an illusory reality of variety or separation distinct from 'actual' reality. So that's two things : Reality and illusion. Then you allude to some process or means to bridge that state, from illusory consciousness to actual consciousness. So now that's a third thing : Application. If one is talking of knowledge, the knower and the act of acquiring knowledge, one has a heavy reliance on form and function at the onset.

I agree there are numerous problems in discerning form and function in this world, but I think it's a bit of stretch to automatically extrapolate these problems to a higher realm. IOW, the statement, "Due to the problems surrounding variety in this realm, any higher realm must be bereft of variety (and hence, also form and function) in order to assert it's ontological superiority" is not something that follows due to any philosophical necessity.

IIRC, Plato alluded to a higher reality of ideal categories, and not a higher reality bereft of category.

(Jan 12, 2020 05:16 AM)Anu Wrote: [ -> ]
(Jan 12, 2020 02:26 AM)Ostronomos Wrote: [ -> ]All that we see in the material world has form and function. But what if the material world is the illusion as indicated by separation?

We are forced to adopt an holistic view of reality that contains the illusion of difference within it. The idea that the mind is fundamental is nothing new. This affords us a perspective of oneness. There would be a Platonic ideal of no form from which the material reality is born. This I concede is the most correct and concise view. An "ultra-mind" would perform most efficiently allowing it access to the God realm. But most of us lack such high performance and must therefore rely upon paltry ability. I am not insulting anyone, just saying Cynicism is rampant in the world today and from this angle we may see how the ordinary person has no access to higher realms.
The problem with such a radical homogeneous view of reality is that one inevitably relies on a world view with more than one singular element at it's core. For instance, you are alluding to an illusory reality of variety or separation distinct from 'actual' reality. So that's two things : Reality and illusion. Then you allude to some process or means to bridge that state, from illusory consciousness to actual consciousness. So now that's a third thing : Application. If one is talking of knowledge, the knower and the act of acquiring knowledge, one has a heavy reliance on form and function at the onset.

I agree there are numerous problems in discerning form and function in this world, but I think it's a bit of stretch to automatically extrapolate these problems to a higher realm. IOW, the statement, "Due to the problems surrounding variety in this realm, any higher realm must be bereft of variety (and hence, also form and function) in order to assert it's ontological superiority" is not something that follows due to any philosophical necessity.

IIRC, Plato alluded to a higher reality of ideal categories, and not a higher reality bereft of category.

I think that we are embodied consciousnesses.

Parts of a whole consciousness that make it possible to perceive according to a common "syntax".

I believe I know what I'm talking about with the syntax thing. It's the way we interpret the pure subjective data.

God's world is unattainable to one with meager abilities.