Scivillage.com Casual Discussion Science Forum

I made the mistake of engaging in a discussion on FB, over Jordan Peterson. Never again.

(Oct 11, 2019 05:40 PM)Leigha Wrote: [ -> ]I made the mistake of engaging in a discussion on FB, over Jordan Peterson. Never again.

There’s a well-known female astronomer that was having trouble with a stalker a few years ago. It was interesting to me because the creepy comments and photos that were involved were highly unusual to say the least. I like puzzles and was able to figure out who the culprit was. It was a female, believe or not, one that she went to college with. After that incident, she invited me to a discussion group with other female scientists, the topic being the use of pseudonyms. It was interesting and I came out of it feeling that they are necessary.  Maybe not in an ideal world but Facebook’s real name policy has had some devasting consequences. I wouldn't use that platform for controversial issues.

Good point, SS ^^ I realize that when I'm getting into these ''debates'' on FB, that I could be interacting with an insane person who finds where I live, and decides to kill me.   Not entirely far fetched in the world we live in.

What I find curious about ''followers'' of Peterson, is this knee-jerk, angry defense many of them snap into, when anyone dares to criticize him. As if they're related to him or his best friend. I'm rather neutral on the guy; he seems at first to be a self-help guru who is innocently well-meaning when it comes to male ''empowerment,'' but when you explore a bit deeper, his opinions of women seem sexist and somewhat confusing. That said, he's entitled to his opinions, but it is just something I've picked up on in observing his fans.

(Oct 12, 2019 05:17 AM)Leigha Wrote: [ -> ]Good point, SS ^^ I realize that when I'm getting into these ''debates'' on FB, that I could be interacting with an insane person who finds where I live, and decides to kill me.   Not entirely far fetched in the world we live in.

Yeah, better safe than sorry. This guy, Dennis Markuse/David Mabus, was a member on Sciforums. I betcha C C remembers him.

(Oct 12, 2019 03:20 PM)Secular Sanity Wrote: [ -> ]

(Oct 12, 2019 05:17 AM)Leigha Wrote: [ -> ]Good point, SS ^^ I realize that when I'm getting into these ''debates'' on FB, that I could be interacting with an insane person who finds where I live, and decides to kill me.   Not entirely far fetched in the world we live in.

Yeah, better safe than sorry. This guy, Dennis Markuse/David Mabus, was a member on Sciforums. I betcha C C remembers him.

Even when they finally get psychiatric treatment it doesn't seem to do much good. Plus, at times having a severe clinical condition seems almost like free pass to continue, now that the days of classic state institutions are long gone. A homeless person could even sign themselves in back then, to get out of the winter.

Koos Nolst Appreciation Thread
https://www.forum.exscn.net/threads/koos...ead.31115/

Why the "Church" is disavowing Koos Nolst Trenite: "We will never know if Koos Nolst Trenite would have become dangerously insane without the "help" of the "Church" of Scientology." [...] "I don't often speak, but I feel that I owe it to the Koos that once was, to say something to the people who read this board. I knew Koos when he was normal. And believe me, he was a normal, fun loving guy. He was intelligent and he was my friend. "

https://twitter.com/causetrinity?lang=en

http://www.angelfire.com/space/platoworld/

(Oct 12, 2019 03:20 PM)Secular Sanity Wrote: [ -> ]

(Oct 12, 2019 05:17 AM)Leigha Wrote: [ -> ]Good point, SS ^^ I realize that when I'm getting into these ''debates'' on FB, that I could be interacting with an insane person who finds where I live, and decides to kill me.   Not entirely far fetched in the world we live in.

Yeah, better safe than sorry. This guy, Dennis Markuse/David Mabus, was a member on Sciforums. I betcha C C remembers him.

  Wow. He has his own wiki page and everything. lol Pretty scary stuff.

(Oct 12, 2019 07:16 PM)Leigha Wrote: [ -> ]  Wow. He has his own wiki page and everything. lol Pretty scary stuff.

Yep. RP was pretty good at spotting his new sockpuppets. I avoided him like the plague.

(Oct 12, 2019 05:17 AM)Leigha Wrote: [ -> ]What I find curious about ''followers'' of Peterson, is this knee-jerk, angry defense many of them snap into, when anyone dares to criticize him. As if they're related to him or his best friend. I'm rather neutral on the guy; he seems at first to be a self-help guru who is innocently well-meaning when it comes to male ''empowerment,'' but when you explore a bit deeper, his opinions of women seem sexist and somewhat confusing. That said, he's entitled to his opinions, but it is just something I've picked up on in observing his fans.

Peterson has genuinely helped a lot of people improve their lives, and they have seen countless people outright lie about, if not just naively misinterpret, him. It's like having someone save your life, and even if you don't really know them personally, you'd naturally be very defensive if anyone attacked them. Just by dent of the positive impact they've had on your life. For me, even though I haven't benefited from Peterson's advice, I defend anything that helps people, like I defend Christianity while not being a Christian. And you have to wonder about people who want to tear down something/someone that helps people. Just because they disagree, they seem to think that no one should have the opportunity to improve their lives by that means. That seems narrow-minded and even malicious.

Just because you, personally, think something may be sexist, why do you feel the need to criticize it? Do his views have an actual, negative impact on your personal life? Or are you just willing to bash something that helps others just because you disagree?

(Oct 12, 2019 10:36 PM)Syne Wrote: [ -> ]

(Oct 12, 2019 05:17 AM)Leigha Wrote: [ -> ]What I find curious about ''followers'' of Peterson, is this knee-jerk, angry defense many of them snap into, when anyone dares to criticize him. As if they're related to him or his best friend. I'm rather neutral on the guy; he seems at first to be a self-help guru who is innocently well-meaning when it comes to male ''empowerment,'' but when you explore a bit deeper, his opinions of women seem sexist and somewhat confusing. That said, he's entitled to his opinions, but it is just something I've picked up on in observing his fans.

Peterson has genuinely helped a lot of people improve their lives, and they have seen countless people outright lie about, if not just naively misinterpret, him. It's like having someone save your life, and even if you don't really know them personally, you'd naturally be very defensive if anyone attacked them. Just by dent of the positive impact they've had on your life. For me, even though I haven't benefited from Peterson's advice, I defend anything that helps people, like I defend Christianity while not being a Christian. And you have to wonder about people who want to tear down something/someone that helps people. Just because they disagree, they seem to think that no one should have the opportunity to improve their lives by that means. That seems narrow-minded and even malicious.

Just because you, personally, think something may be sexist, why do you feel the need to criticize it? Do his views have an actual, negative impact on your personal life? Or are you just willing to bash something that helps others just because you disagree?

I can comment on anything I want lol Again, I stated that I’m neutral about him but have observed certain things about his fan base. Just because you respect something or someone doesn’t mean everyone will understand why you do. And I don’t disrespect all of his ideas, but I question some of his motives. He brings up negative points about women too often to be a guy simply concerned with helping men be their best selves. It’s no different than a feminist who slips in a few negative slurs about men in order to “empower” women.

I believe in God but I don’t insult people who don’t believe in him. You feel the need to insult me and SS and anyone who dares to utter a negative word about Peterson. *shrug*

Syne Wrote:Peterson has genuinely helped a lot of people improve their lives

Just from the last few posts it does seem like Peterson has the qualities of a charismatic leader. Examples of charismatic leaders include Hitler, Charles Manson, Mohamed, Attila the Hun, Greta Thunberg and Martin Luther King. Just because someone is a charismatic leader doesn't necessarily make them 'a good thing'. The followers of charismatic leaders have (by definition) suspended judgement in favour of 'something'. I think it absolutely reasonable to try to find out what people are suspending judgement in favour of without making the assumption that it is a good thing.