Scivillage.com Casual Discussion Science Forum

https://aeon.co/ideas/men-want-beauty-wo...tific-tosh

EXCERPT: . . . Many evolutionary psychologists put this trend down to the power of innate biological drives. Their argument is that women have a primeval urge to hang on to wealthy men to provide for their children during the long period of pregnancy and childrearing. Men, meanwhile, are mostly concerned about a woman’s fertility, for which beauty and youth serve as helpful cues. In the distant past, this behaviour was adaptive, and so evolution selected and encoded it in our genes, forever. [...]

However, there has been a tectonic shift in gender roles over the past 50 years. [...] are we still at the mercy of our biological destiny, as evolutionary psychologists claim?

The results from the research are clear: mating preferences among men and women look increasingly similar. The trend is directly tied to increasing gender equality, as women gain greater access to resources and opportunities in business, politics and education. In more gender-unequal nations, such as Turkey, women rate the earning potential of partners as twice as important compared with women in the most gender-equal nations, such as Finland. As with Josh and Mia, Finnish men are now more likely than Finnish women to select partners based on their high level of education.

Of course, sexism varies within each society [...] But if mating preferences are biologically predetermined, individual sexism shouldn’t have an impact. However, research carried out in nine nations proves the opposite. The more gender-unequal men’s personal attitudes, the more they prefer qualities in women such as youth and attractiveness; and the more gender-unequal women’s attitudes, the more they prefer qualities in men such as money and status. This evidence points to some serious flaws in the evolutionary psychologists’ narrative. If genes determine our mating preferences, how is it that these supposedly hardwired instincts erode in line with societies’ and individual’s gender-egalitarianism?

MORE: https://aeon.co/ideas/men-want-beauty-wo...tific-tosh

I'm a man. What do I want in a soulmate? Not just beauty. And certainly not wealth. I guess I want a close friend I can share thoughts and experiences with...who understands me and accepts me for who I am. Sex is pretty much a non-issue for me. I'm not interested in that. But I am way past believing in the ideal of a soulmate out there waiting to be met. I accept my aloneness wholeheartedly. It is natural and indemic to who I am.

"Professor David Bainbridge, of the University of Cambridge said that intelligence is by far the most attractive quality for men looking for a long term partner because it demonstrates that his chosen partner is likely to be a responsible parent.

If men are honest, do they really prize intelligence over looks?

It also suggests she was brought by intelligent parents and so was likely to be well fed and looked after in childhood, and so healthier."
- http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2016/...-in-women/


"Just because women know the conspicuous spender is primarily looking for a fling, that doesn’t mean they won’t try to turn that fling into something more."
- https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/1...79760.html

Could it be when two people spend endless hours belittling one another that it must be a sign that it's not only beauty or wealth that stirs the drink?

Do mutual feelings, albeit disrespectful, create an aura of admiration?

(Dec 23, 2017 04:50 PM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: [ -> ]Do mutual feelings, albeit disrespectful, create an aura of admiration?

That only seems to work on women.

(Dec 23, 2017 06:13 PM)Syne Wrote: [ -> ]

(Dec 23, 2017 04:50 PM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: [ -> ]Do mutual feelings, albeit disrespectful, create an aura of admiration?

That only seems to work on women.

Is flattery something women trust in more than men? Where on the list does honesty sit?

Could never figure out how some women end up with control freaks. Are women fooled easier than men?

(Dec 24, 2017 03:16 PM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: [ -> ]Is flattery something women trust in more than men? Where on the list does honesty sit?

Could never figure out how some women end up with control freaks. Are women fooled easier than men?

Are you saying that you don't think that men are susceptible to flattery or end up with control freaks?

(Dec 24, 2017 03:16 PM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: [ -> ]

(Dec 23, 2017 06:13 PM)Syne Wrote: [ -> ]

(Dec 23, 2017 04:50 PM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: [ -> ]Do mutual feelings, albeit disrespectful, create an aura of admiration?

That only seems to work on women.

Is flattery something women trust in more than men? Where on the list does honesty sit?

Could never figure out how some women end up with control freaks. Are women fooled easier than men?

I would actually assume women distrust flattery more than men, since they naturally pay a potentially higher price for sex and they typically hear enough flattery to devalue it.

Women do seem especially susceptible to disrespect, partially due to their self-esteem and partially due to their attraction to "bad boys". Women often aren't aware that their professed desires do not match their subconscious/instinctive desires.

(Dec 29, 2017 05:40 PM)Secular Sanity Wrote: [ -> ]

(Dec 24, 2017 03:16 PM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: [ -> ]Is flattery something women trust in more than men? Where on the list does honesty sit?

Could never figure out how some women end up with control freaks. Are women fooled easier than men?

Are you saying that you don't think that men are susceptible to flattery or end up with control freaks?

Not at all. You know I blame everything on evolution, this way I can keep the topic on the science road. So I guess what I'm asking is if evolution has made flattery & control a type of adaptation? Since my genetic makeup doesn't seem to include exerting control over opposite sex, then I have to assume that particular element is on the way out, making me a mutant if it's abnormal to be so. 

Pretty simple look at things. I don't really care what women want and I'm not even sure what it is I bring to the table. But when this mutant meets that other receptive mutant, we're not fooling anybody, least not ourselves. 

(Dec 29, 2017 06:51 PM)Zinjanthropos Wrote: [ -> ]I don't really care what women want and I'm not even sure what it is I bring to the table. But when this mutant meets that other receptive mutant, we're not fooling anybody, least not ourselves. 

Men are generally more aggressive and ostentatious. This is inadvertently mistaken for confidence. As far as control freaks are concerned, they can appear to be organized, responsible, and upstanding.

I think the article is on point, though. My friend is financially independent and one hell of a cougar. I always try to get her to date someone closer to her age but she says she still has to sit across the table from them.

Nietzsche was right.

"Finally, women. If we consider the whole history of women, are they not obliged first of all, and above all to be actresses?"-Nietzsche

We are better actresses, and a little more empathetic, but we notice.

Grey hair; sexy on a good looking man. Wrinkles; minor ones are sexy on a good looking man. Everything else, we simply tolerate for the same reasons that you do.

Nietzsche and MR were right.

"It is not a lack of love, but a lack of friendship that makes unhappy marriages."-Nietzsche

"You can take my word for it, that for men like me, a marriage after the type of Goethe's would be the best of all—that is to say, a marriage with a good housekeeper! But even this idea is repellent to me. A young and cheerful daughter to whom I would be an object of reverence would be much more to the point. The best of all, however, would be to have my good old Lama again. For a philosopher, a sister is an excellent philanthropic institution, particularly when she is bright, brave, and loving (no old vinegar flask like G. Keller's sister), but as a rule one only recognizes such truths when it is too late."-Nietzsche

Do you know why he called his sister Lama?