(Aug 28, 2021 09:22 PM)Syne Wrote: [ -> ]Biden already had blood on his hands, before the bombing. People getting trampled and falling from planes in the mad rush to flee the Taliban, the Taliban killing "traitors" who aided the US, etc.. And he'd have all the Afghan blood and terror resulting from the US withdrawal, even if a bombing never occurred. Biden didn't have to pull the bulk of the 2,500 troops weeks before his own, arbitrary Aug 31st deadline. That alone meant there were fewer extraction points and that evacuations would be slow, as they bottle-necked at a single airfield. Biden didn't have to announce his deadline to the Taliban or give them a list of US citizens, green card holders, and allies, which they could use as a kill list. He could have left the minimal contingent of 2,500 to keep the country stable and ISIS free, which is a much smaller force than we have in Japan, South Korea, Guam, Germany, Italy, the UK, etc., none of which any moron Democrats are demanding we pull out of. And even if he was set on withdrawal, he could have made sure all civilians were evacuated first and try to keep US military equipment and weapons out of Taliban hands.
I'm pretty sure that I remember trump earmarking withdrawal "by September" some years back, before Biden was in office (afterall trump was the one that made a deal with the taliban for withdrawal).
I doubt any politician or military strategist would of considered that the taliban would of regained control so quickly, so the original plan that might seem flawed now was likely perfectly fine then.
As with anything in life though, you can't be angry and complain about the what ifs, you've got to look at what the breaks are and reassess to deal with it (adapt).
(Aug 28, 2021 11:46 PM)stryder Wrote: [ -> ]I'm pretty sure that I remember trump earmarking withdrawal "by September" some years back, before Biden was in office (afterall trump was the one that made a deal with the taliban for withdrawal).
I doubt any politician or military strategist would of considered that the taliban would of regained control so quickly, so the original plan that might seem flawed now was likely perfectly fine then.
As with anything in life though, you can't be angry and complain about the what ifs, you've got to look at what the breaks are and reassess to deal with it (adapt).
Yes, Trump did make a deal for withdrawal. But every military strategist and Biden advisor knew this wasn't the way to do it. What no one expected was for Biden to yank the troops so suddenly that the Afghan military would collapse without the US air support they were trained to expect. That was never perfectly fine, and many told Biden as much beforehand.
Biden is only adapting by abandoning all the gains of the last 20 years, the live sacrificed to achieve them, and US citizens and allies on the ground. Apologetics for Biden are tantamount to excusing the deaths and human rights violations the Taliban has already brought back to Afghanistan.
The Trump-Taliban deal wasn't unilateral, and it was meant to facilitate peace negotiations between the insurgent, militant Taliban and the Afghan government.
The deal was supported by China, Russia and Pakistan and unanimously endorsed by the UN Security Council
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afghan_pea...eal_(2020)
Obviously, Biden's move did anything but secure peace.
London has announced that British troops have evacuated from Kabul, thus winding up the UK's mission in Afghanistan.
There are said to still be about 3,500 US troops at the airport. The US State Department says that there are still about 350 US citizens in Kabul who have been in contact with embassy staff and indicated a desire to leave. The US has announced that it has intelligence that new attacks on the airport are immanent and the stranded Americans have been told to stay away.
(Aug 29, 2021 05:52 AM)Yazata Wrote: [ -> ]London has announced that British troops have evacuated from Kabul, thus winding up the UK's mission in Afghanistan.
There are said to still be about 3,500 US troops at the airport. The US State Department says that there are still about 350 US citizens in Kabul who have been in contact with embassy staff and indicated a desire to leave. The US has announced that it has intelligence that new attacks on the airport are immanent and the stranded Americans have been told to stay away.
They're playing word games with "who have been in contact with embassy staff and indicated a desire to leave." They are just assuming that anyone unable to contact them wants to stay.
The political tides are turning against the Biden presidency
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/...d=msedgntp
INTRO: The recent decline in support for President Joe Biden and his administration likely means that the Democratic party will lose control of the House and potentially the Senate in 2022 - and also makes it increasingly likely that Biden will be a one-term president.
Just 41 percent of registered voters now approve of Biden, while 55 percent disapprove, according to a USA Today/Suffolk County survey released last week. President Biden's approval rating has markedly deteriorated, having dropped 16 points since this Spring.
In early May, Biden's approval rating stood at 57 percent with 38 percent disapproving, according to a Politico poll among registered voters. To note, other public polls around this time generally showed the president's approval in the mid-50's range.
What explains Biden's precipitous decline? On the key issues facing the country - the economy, immigration, the pandemic and Afghanistan - Biden and Democrats receive negative ratings. And speaking as professional pollsters, when an incumbent party trails so significantly on the key challenges facing the country close to one year before an election, it is a potential harbinger of ill for that party... (
MORE
And back on Aug 18:
Rasmussen Poll: Majority says Biden to blame for Afghanistan
- - - - - -
Not so fast, though. Hold that runaway sleigh ride into premature forecasting.
Biden could recover via a national disaster from Hurricane Ida. His team had Joe prodded awake and gung-ho at the helm Saturday morning. In retrospect, the press will highlight the preliminary hand-wringing and preparatory displays. ("He's the President who cares!").
Joe will be posturing in the coming days as the bureaucratic altruism version of the good Samaritan -- the empathetic superhero and federal aid Salvation-Rescuer Paragon rising nobly above the ruins and deaths of the horrible aftermath. By the end of the week, the media will fade the Afghanistan fiasco to a back-page story.
Sweeping in behind a regional disaster is not going to get a whole country to forget about all our collective disasters suffered at the hands of Biden. Immigration and Afghanistan are solely on Biden, with the economy somewhat shared with Congressional and Gubernatorial Democrats, and the oft-contradictory pandemic response spread pretty evenly on the party in power.
And any remaining US citizens, green card holders, or allies are truly on their own, after the US told them to stay away from the airport.
It appears that the US has stopped flying Afghans out of Kabul and is now concentrating on getting Americans out. In addition to several thousand remaining military troops, the new york times (not exactly a reliable source) says there are about 500 American civilian citizens left, about 250 of which have been in touch and want to leave (some of whom are already at the airport) and about 250 who plan to stay. These are probably almost all ethnic Afghans with family there.
I don't know what will happen to the various armored vehicles and helicopters at the airport when the last Americans leave. Will they be abandoned? Will they be blown up to keep them from falling into Taliban hands? Will be interesting to see how that unfolds.
We are down to the final 24 hours.
(Aug 29, 2021 11:21 PM)C C Wrote: [ -> ]Not so fast, though. Hold that runaway sleigh ride into premature forecasting.
Biden could recover via a national disaster from Hurricane Ida.
That's already fading into the rear view mirror. A number of small communities were devastated but loss of life seems to be low. A major American city isn't on its knees. (If it was, the President would be blamed for it.)
Quote:By the end of the week, the media will fade the Afghanistan fiasco to a back-page story.
Maybe. The vulnerability there will the the Americans left behind. They will be like gold for Islamic militants, one of the most valuable commodities in Afghanistan. Kidnap a couple, show them blindfolded and tied up, and the militants have the world's attention for whatever their demands are.
Well. the last US troops are out of Kabul.
The Commander of the US Central Command admits that there are several hundred US citizens in Kabul who wanted to leave and were left behind.
The last message from the US Embassy in Afghanistan informs Americans still in Kabul that operations have been suspended, but assures them that their safety is the US government's highest priority and advises them to enroll in the State Department's safe traveler program (?!) and a couple of other boilerplate suggestions given to all foreign travelers. (Translation, you're shit-outta-luck.)
https://af.usembassy.gov/security-messag...perations/
And there are photographs of Taliban fighters wearing left-behind US uniforms, carrying left-behind US rifles, admiring left-behind US helicopters in the hangers at Kabul airport.
Pentagon spokesman John Kirby was asked about those photos, and he assured all the reporters that all the US equipment left behind has been rendered unusable.
https://news.yahoo.com/pentagon-military...15670.html
Kirby told cnn: "They can inspect all they want. They can look at them, they can walk around, but they can't fly them. They can't operate them. We made sure to demilitarize, to make unusable, all the gear that is at the airport."
Which is pretty clearly untrue, since Taliban pilots have already been seen taking practice flights in US Blackhawks.
Here's a video that appears to show a captured US Blackhawk flying over Kabul with the body of a "traitor" hanging beneath the aircraft as some kind of warning to the city's public.
https://twitter.com/sudhirchaudhary/stat...4521772035
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